As for T/W ratio, well it really aint that much, and in a turn it will have to make up for the extra drag of the F-15.
Have I ever disagreed with that ??? No. However there's a reason the gatling gun is there. If a lock on is impossible or if the missiles fail and you're forced into a dogfight, then the superior dogfighting capability and addition of a gatling gun will come in handy.Again, no one fights in the horizontal in this century unless they want to die quickly
But which a/c can fire the Phoenix missile ? The F-14.I could somewhat agree on the radar depending on the scenrio and the time period. By now even the F-14D radar is bettered by many aircraft
Okay today the radars have become better, but in 1991 where the latest version of both a/c were in service the F-14 had a distinct advantage.
Last edited by FLYBOYJ; 10-27-2008 at 11:49 AM.
That's odd, I've heard the exact opposite. A hard breaking turn in the horizontal was the recommended evasive maneuver against the smaller & lighter a/c of the instructors, as well as against MIG-29's.as a matter of fact its taught at Top Gun (When the F-14 was operational) NOT to turn with any fighter (unless you're fighting an F-4 or MiG-25).
Hi Guys, to set the score straight (if that can be done) in 1999 F-14Ds from VF2 on patrol in Southern Watch squeezed off two phoenix's but the Mig-23s (or Mig-25s) depending on the teller detected the missile launch and turned away at high speed opening Vc. One missile went dumb into the ground. Both missed. An F-18 was ordered to take a Sparrow shot but range was opening very quickly. So the first combat (and only) use did not fair well.
Durning ACEVAL/AIMVAL at nellis between 1975-78 the USAF tried to validate tactics and types of missiles. Near the end of this engagement a forbidden conflict was arranged(F14 vs F15). The outcome was classified for quite a while, not so much for intel but for political sensitivities.
It went down like this; There was no ROE, The F-14s opened at BVR range and ACMI indicated quite a few splashes, once they closed to med to short range they were decimated by the F-15. (No brag just fact)
As for the F-16, my experience was if you hang a pod you effectively degrade the eagle eyes and the fight is now in the "phonebooth" And it is a knife fight with the F-15 bleeding badly.
In my current job I have at my fingertips the "real" data from F-5s to the Typhoon cause everyone is trying to sell their wares here.
Current open sources are pretty close but the fact that the Typhoon hasn't won a major sale outside europe is telling....saudi doesn't count. The maintainablity factor is more than double the F-18. Also the F-16 Block 60 with its AESA is kicking everyone's ass in this region.
If you wish to maintain the AR of the F-14 in transonic to supersonic is greater - prove it (it will be tough). If you wish to maintain the F-14 radar is superior - prove it. If you want to dismiss the huge energy manueverability disadvantage for the F-14, show how 20-25% higher T/W ratio, 20% lower lift loading and higher acceleration for both the F-16 and F-15 - is to the F-14 advantage.. prove it.
Last - you wish to fall back to your stream tube dissertaion, and repeat slowly what you think you mean - then tell us again how 'small stream tube' implies more efficiency - help us out by proving the small, heavy swing wing F-14 has a less concentrated tip vortex and a more efficient wing than say a a U-2.
Knock yourself out - you can use either swing wing or swept for the -14 to prove it's 'efficiency' over the much larger 'stream tube'
I would start with L/D but that would be silly me.
Last edited by DerAdlerIstGelandet; 10-27-2008 at 03:03 PM.
Does the F-16 even have a leg to stand on in this discussion, or is it so far outclassed that this debate should be between the F-15 and F-14 only?
Maybe the F-16 would have a chance with Doug Masters in the cockpit.
AWG-9: For it's time, the most powerful airborne radar system in the world; able to track up to 24 targets at a time, and launch missles at 6 of them at one time. Range well in excess of 100 nm. However, it is based and built using analog technology from the '60's, was maintenance intensive, and was completely incapapable of being used in an a2g mode (which is why the F-14D got the AN/APG-71 digital multi-mode radar); could probably best be compared to the RP-25 Smerch radar on the later MiG-25 interceptor.
AN/APG-63(V)3: Completely digital, multi-mode AESA technology, classified range (the broadly similar radar in the F-22, the AN/APG-77, has a range "in excess of 320 miles"), multiple LRU's, can be used interchangably in both a2a & a2g modes, LPI frequency-hopping (the AWG-9 couldn't do this).