A few questions about Bf-109

Discussion in 'IL-2 Sturmovik Pilot's Lounge' started by mangaroca, Oct 18, 2007.

  1. mangaroca

    mangaroca New Member

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    Hi All,

    Here they are:

    - When being a leader (first to take off) which groups of planes are which when it comes to contacting them on the radio and giving orders? "Rotten something" (first one), "staffel" (second one and the following, depending on the number of groups participating) and "schwarm". I think there is one more left... :/ Please, explain which are fighters, which are bombers; what's the hierarchy; which is the main group, which is a secondary group; why there's no TACTICAL and NAVIGATION sub-menus in the first group ("rotten something"), etc...

    - Say I am a leader of a 4-plane group (bf-109s). When and in what way I should contact my wingmen and give them orders? What should thoseorders be? What I mean is: what to say on the ground (to make them follow me and take-off), how to check where I should lead the group to (direction to target, should I give ,y wingmen an order to engage all targets at will just after take-off or only after an enemy is spotted, how to make them land, why aren't they reacting to me CHANGE FORMATION -> say, DIAMOND formation orders???

    - Could somebody explain and present the way radiator and prop pitch should be used when flying the Bf-109? Does open radiator give more cooling to the engine but also bigger drag? Will taxiing with radiator closed cause engine overheating? And please, give the "by the book" manual prop pith and radiator settings for situations like:
    * take off
    * transit (300-450 km/h???)
    * air combat (in general, unless there is a difference in settings when engaging a slower bomber and a more agile fighter)
    * climbing
    * descending
    * chase
    * landing
    * taxiing
    I just wonder how much you can squeeze out of the Bf-109 using manual (instead of auto) prop pitch and radiator management... ;>

    Big thanks to anyone who will bother to answer my questions! :)

    PS. Please, make sure all the data refer to BF-109!
     
  2. eddie_brunette

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    hi, did you try to install the english translation voice pack?

    I think the ai has a mind of their own sometimes though. I usaully just worried about my wingman (TAB 1).

    last night while playing" 9th FS 49th FG 25 mission campaign - New Guinea: May 1943 - March 1944" campaign, I gave flight 4 and 5 to order attack fighters, flight 2(mine) and 3 to attack bombers, but in all honesty I dont know if they did it, was to busy trying to stay alive :)
     
  3. Amsel

    Amsel Active Member

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    I rarely use the radiator settings on the Me 109 unless I am in a dogfight or am trying to get out of the area fast or I am strafing ground targets. The 109 has a auto setting.

    When I am dogfighting and in the advantage I set it on open. It creates drag but that does not hurt me when in battle. It might even help a little bit. I also use it open when I am in a tight situation fighting several planes because I need max power but I do not want to overheat. Always close it though when you are taking flak or strafing the ground. Being closed it will prevent serious engine damage possibly.

    You might just need to play with it a bit. If you want to know more just let me know.
     
  4. eddie_brunette

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    Be very careful in using manual proppitch with 109, I've fried my engine in seconds tryin to use it

    edd
     
  5. kool kitty89

    kool kitty89 Well-Known Member

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    How do you use manual pitch on the 109? (is it the same way to manually use the flaps?)
     
  6. timshatz

    timshatz Active Member

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    Good set of missions, in the middle of it myself. Trick that works is to keep your speed up. Gradual climbs and dives do that the best. Slashing attacks. Don't bother turning, no go.
     
  7. Amsel

    Amsel Active Member

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    I am currently in the middle of White Sun Blue Sky. It is possibly one of the best ever made. You fly with the Hells Angels in China. Very good briefs and excellent maps. The action is fierce as it should be.

    Never try to turn with Japanese aircraft in a P-40. Dive , attack, dive, and climb like hell for the clouds or die!:D
     
  8. KrazyKraut

    KrazyKraut Banned

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    Personally I never touch the prop pitch. Although I now (barely) know how to not kill the engine, it never gave me any real advantage and is a lot of extra work.

    I usually set my radiator to 4 or 6 in a dogfight, although you can leave it to automatic and probably won't lose much.
     
  9. B-17engineer

    B-17engineer Active Member

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    Great info guys!
     
  10. VALENGO

    VALENGO Member

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    I tried once manual prop pitch in an Emil and suddenly the engine died, without an advice, <:(


    About Luftwaffe´s hierarchy and other stuff, the best is read one of many sites where is explained how was formed an staffel, rotte, kette, etc. It is quite simple.
     
  11. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Your Rottenfleiger is your wingman, his command list is first in the menu. (TAB + 1) You normally would do well to allow him to remain formed on your wing.

    The first Schwarm (Schwarm 1) is your total flight formed by you as it's leader, then your Rottenfleiger (wingman) and the remainder of pilots. This is second on the menu (Tab + 2).

    The second Schwarm would be any other aircraft directly under your command (TAB + 3 = Schwarm 2, TAB + 4 = Schwarm 3, TAB + 5 = Schwarm 4).

    To give a command to the entire group (Staffel), you use TAB + 6.

    A Schwarm can be a group of two, three or four aircraft, it all depends on the mission and/or flight strength.

    If I wanted my flight (Schwarm) to tighten up on me during a mission for example, I would press TAB + 2, then select number 8, then select number 3. They'll acknowledge, and move in closer to my position.

    The best thing to do, to get in some practice with your commands, is run some quick mission rounds, with all four Schwarms and without enemies present. Then as you get a little more familiar, add a few enemies and sick your Schwarms on them.

    As far as the radiator goes on a Bf109, I've never noticed any reduction in speed if I leave it open, and in the "closed" position, it opens and closes automatically, as it was designed to do. Unless I'm running a winter mission, I'll open the radiator as soon as I take off, and leave it that way for the duration. Best thing to do, though, is always keep your eye on the gauges!

    Hope this helps :)
     
  12. VALENGO

    VALENGO Member

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    Beginners must NOT forget Tab+7 ;D

    If I fly a 109 (and other airplanes) at speed x8, at level (not climbing or diving) and open the radiator, the speed falls a little. Maybe that it is not noticeable flying at normal time, but sure there is drag.
    I have not tried it with latest machines, as P51, wich was designed to obtain extra thrust from the radiator exhaust.
     
  13. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Good advice, Valengo!

    I've also found that using the Tab + 7 can also draw friendlies back towards your position to create confusion amongst the enemy...

    Like I posted earlier though, it just takes a little practice to get the hang of the options...once you get it figured out, you'll wonder how you ever got by without the commands!
     
  14. VALENGO

    VALENGO Member

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    I regret a few things that there´s not in the game:
    1) interactive panel, as in CFS
    2) ¡¡¡ WEAPONS RELOAD, PLEASE, OLEG !!!,
    and, last but not least,
    3) more options under TAB, for sample, giving orders to enemies in his own frequency, in order to spread confussion between them.

    Ah, I forget one very important item: why friendly AAA NEVER shoot at my plane? Those guys seems to be perfect spotters and never confuse friendly planes with enemy planes.
     
  15. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    I have to agree with you Valengo, there could be better communication options for the friendly flights. For example, if my #3 in my flight was heavily damaged, I'd want to tell him specifically to return to base, but I can't unless I send my entire Schwarm home, and so he just stays in the fight until his machine quits or catches on fire.

    I have never tried it, but if you press Tab + 9, you can change your "frequency" from friendly to enemy...perhaps you can "talk" to them via the ~ chat method...

    Like I said, I've never tried it other than to listen in to thier comms when I'm fighting them.

    The interactive panel idea was ok in CFS2, but I spent more time looking down and trying to click an object with the mouse, than I did flying, so I'm pretty much ok with the way it is.

    And beleive me, when you're trying to ward off attacking enemy at a friendly airbase, you can get hit...I have a number of times, though I have seen "our guys" try and avoid hitting me, there's just too much stuff going on, and there's a good chance you'll get nailed eventually.
     
  16. VALENGO

    VALENGO Member

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    Well, Grau, playing against the PC, enemies don´t listen to you (I have tried it). I´ve never played multiplayer.
    I agree with you about fighting and trying to use an interactive control panel, it is not the very best thing to do when someone tries to shoot you down, but in ease parts of the game (take off, etc) I found it very funny.
    And about friendly AAA, yes I have catched friendly fire, but they are not shooting at me, they are just shooting.
    I´d like to see any time (not all of the time), when I make a hard dive to my lines (looking for shelter, you know), that the flak reacts in a wrong way.
     
  17. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Ahh...I see where your going with the AA...you mean the occasional friendly fire thing...dang, that would be crazy!

    I understand that Oleg is working on enhanced AI characteristics that would have them more reactive to weather, camouflage, time of day, etc...

    I would really enjoy that, because there's been plenty of times I've dove into a cloudbank, only to have an AI tailgunner laserbeam me when there was no possible way I could have been seen. Same goes for night-Ops, and coming in on a bomber's 7 on a moonless night which should be nearly impossible to be spotted, yet they line right up on me, and blow me out of the cockpit...

    In night combat, the aircraft's exhaust was the determining factor in a successful kill, and was a dead give-away if you weren't careful of your own position, so I'm glad that Oleg is taking all this into account for the next generation of sims.
     
  18. Amsel

    Amsel Active Member

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    The main thing I don't like about the AI is that they seem to have unlimited ammo. That is irritating.
     
  19. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Yeah Amsel, I've noticed that too...

    Never could figure that one out...
     
  20. kool kitty89

    kool kitty89 Well-Known Member

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    In what circumstances? I often find the AI's (in single player) running out of ammo.
     
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