A jet P-51 Mustang?

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by pampa14, Aug 21, 2016.

  1. pampa14

    pampa14 Active Member

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    Look at this! Did You know this rare and unusual version of the P-51 Mustang? The link below has some photos and a question: this version entered service or combat? To see all the pictures and answer the question above, please visit the link below and leave your comment.


    Aviação em Floripa: P-51 Mustang a jato


    Best Regards!
     
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  2. airminded88

    airminded88 Member

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    I'm sure Bill and other members will come up with a much more detailed and comprehensive explanation of the 'P-51 Mustang jet fighter'. However, I could say that those seem to be enhancements either in rocketry or pulse jet technology in an attempt to close the gap in speed with the German jets; not jet engines per say.

    Anyways, there is P-51 jet fighter IMO: F-86 Sabre
     
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  3. davparlr

    davparlr Well-Known Member

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    A closer jet power P-51 is the FJ-1
     

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  4. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    The explanation is in the title - jato - jet assisted take off. However, i believe these were trials of different types of prototype rocket, pulse jet and jet engines, using a P-51 as a test bed.
     
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  5. drgondog

    drgondog Well-Known Member

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    Yes to test bed on the pulse jet under wings. The Jato type rocket on Center line of 44-72099 was a response to give the P-51 a kick in a chase after Me 262. With two 75 gal drop tanks gave it about 1 minute and enabled a speed increase from 429 to 513mph. VE day basically suspended future development.
     
  6. airminded88

    airminded88 Member

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    Was it ever tested in combat ops?
     
  7. GrauGeist

    GrauGeist Well-Known Member

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    Those P-51 experimental types had pulsejets, ramjets and a rocket-booster but no pure jet engine.

    The jet interceptor P-51 (44-7309) had an Aerojet liquid fuel rocket and if you look closely just ahead of the cockpit, you can see the inlets in the fuselage.
    The Pulsejet equipped P-51 was using two Ford PJ1-31-1 units.
    The Ramjet equipped P-51 (46-3528) was a post-war expirement.

    I suppose the closest thing the Mustang ever came to having an actual jet engine as propulsion, would be the Cavalier Mustang II project, eventually becoming the Piper Pa48 Enforcer - which came about long after WWII.
     
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  8. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    Here's one that gets mostly forgotten: the Piper Enforcer.

    [​IMG]

    Another turbine variety of updated Mustang airframe. At least this pic shows it airborne and actually committing aviation.

    Looks to me like a converted D model with a P-51H type extended tail fin, no doubt to deal with the extra torque of the turbine. They actually built 4 of them and the turbine was a Lycoming of 2,455 ehp. 2 of the 4 built still exist; one in the Air Force Flight Test Museum (Edwards AFB) and the other at Wright-Patterson.
     
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  9. drgondog

    drgondog Well-Known Member

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    No to the rocket assist use in combat. After VE day, the only adversary was Japan... No Me 262s
     
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  10. tyrodtom

    tyrodtom Well-Known Member

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    I guess nobody climbs up that left wing when the engine is running on the ground.
     
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  11. Gnomey

    Gnomey World Travelling Doctor
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    Interesting stuff!
     
  12. chuter

    chuter Member

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    The irony is that Air Force test pilots never flew the two Piper built Enforcers (the last two built and that survive, the photo above shows one of the two Cavaliers) because, though Congress appropriated money for flight testing (against the Air Forces' wishes) there were no Air Force pilots officially tail wheel qualified (or that's the excuse given to Congress). So two aircraft in the Air Force Museum were never flown by Air force personnel.
     
  13. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps, but they WERE flown. And that is the point I was making. Turbine designs were many ... not all were flown. This one was.

    The pilots for Piper were likely former military because no Piper Cub pilot was going to volunteer to fly a Mustang with even more HP than stock. I have a pilot's license and occasionally fly C-172, C-182 and the Piper equivalents ... but I wouldn't volunteer to fl;y a Mustang and nobody else with any sense would either. I'm SURE Piper looked at the test pilot logbooks. I have inquired and they did.
     
  14. BiffF15

    BiffF15 Well-Known Member

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    If the USAF had wanted a guy or guys to fly it I think they could have found someone. I would bet if they had looked in the Test Pilot Grad pool there would have been someone who could have been spun up in short order.

    Cheers,
    Biff
     
  15. drgondog

    drgondog Well-Known Member

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    At that time there were so many Korea and WWII vets still on active duty that had P-51 time.
     
  16. tyrodtom

    tyrodtom Well-Known Member

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    The air force definitely still had plenty of A1 qualified pilots in 1971, they couldn't have retired them all.
    In the air force of that era, if you didn't fly jets, you were treated like a lost stepchild.
    I was enlisted at NKP Thailand, where they only operated prop jobs at that time, except C-141s, and returning jets crippled over North Vietnam, but I had some interaction with the pilots on the flight line.

    Some of the pilots assigned to fly the A1s , A-26, and 0-2s acted like they'd been demoted to be sent there to fly those aircraft.
     
  17. BiffF15

    BiffF15 Well-Known Member

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    Tyrodtom,

    The pilots probably felt that way because they would rather have been flying the newer equipment rather than the last war (or two) leftovers. I'm not saying the prop A/C didn't do a good job, just saying from a flyers perspective.

    Cheers,
    Biff

    PS I flew the OV-10 before getting to the Eagle and that was in the early 90's.
     
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  18. tyrodtom

    tyrodtom Well-Known Member

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    #18 tyrodtom, Aug 28, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2016
    I think the 0-2 pilots were volunteers, but the others were assigned. They may have felt it was almost a death sentence, to both their life and career.

    You think ,WOW, if you're flying a aircraft your dad might have flown, but if you're flying that aircraft AND people are going to be shooting at you, you're probably not going to feel blessed.

    More dangerous bombing Ho-Chi-Minh trail day and night in old aircraft, and not career enhancing either flying obsolete aircraft.
     
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  19. BiffF15

    BiffF15 Well-Known Member

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  20. Old Wizard

    Old Wizard Well-Known Member

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