I understand about the use of the last digit of the contract year as the first digit of an aircraft's serial number, painted on the tail or wherever, but I'm curious about one aspect that I haven't been able to find photos of. Suppose a particular aircraft was the very first one in a given contract year, how would that have been shown on the aircraft? "X" for the year, then just the number 1, or 0001, or what?
AAC/AAF serial numbers?
- Thread starter OldGeezer
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
AAF (AAC) prototypes still carried the year/serial convention, same as accepted production aircraft.
For example, Lockheed's XP-58 carried 12670 (41-12670) on the tail, Beech's XA-38 carried 314406 (43-14406) in the tail, etc.
The serial numbers were assigned in blocks and an X or Y type would be given a serial in between other type's serial numbers and later, if the prototype was accepted, would then be assigned a production block of it's own.
For example, Lockheed's XP-58 carried 12670 (41-12670) on the tail, Beech's XA-38 carried 314406 (43-14406) in the tail, etc.
The serial numbers were assigned in blocks and an X or Y type would be given a serial in between other type's serial numbers and later, if the prototype was accepted, would then be assigned a production block of it's own.
- Thread starter
- #3
I understand that in general, I just can't figure out what would be shown on the aircraft for very early numbers within a given year. "41-1" for example just doesn't sound right. It can't be filled to the right with zeroes because that would directly conflict with later serials, so I'm wondering if it would be "41-001" or something on the aircraft.
Hi Oldgeezer,
I wrote this a while back, but I think it answers your question:
This is going to have to be the short version of this story. The serial-number-based radio call numbers were introduced by the Chief of the Air Corps on 28 November 1939 in Circular 100-4 (released by none other than LtCol Ira C. Eaker). This radio call number would be ordered applied as a tail marking on 28 October 1941, though it took some time to apply.
Each aircraft's serial number comprised the last two digits of the fiscal year in which the aircraft was ORDERED and an individual, sequential serial. Since most aircraft didn't last more than ten years (more below) the first digit would be dropped. The radio call had to comprise four digits, so that ground stations hearing only three digits would understand that the transmission had broken up. If the radio call was only two or three digits, zeros were to be inserted to make four digits. Thus 38-3 became 8003 and 39-24 became 9024.
The first problem was that Circular 100-4 did not understand the nature of the FY serial number, insisting that the first two digits represented "the year in which the airplane was manufactured." An aircraft manufactured in 1937, but not ordered by the Army until FY 1938 would be a problem, as would an aircraft ordered in FY 1940 but not delivered until 1941. You'll find a heap of errors on the tails of various aircraft, but the mistake came from painters following faulty instructions.
I noted that most aircraft would serve less than ten years, but some lasted much longer. In those cases, the radio call was to be preceded by the letter "O" (not another zero). Thus, serial 25-326 was to be identified as O-5326 "Oh-Five-Three-Two-Six" after 1934.
Note that some manufacturers would occassionally omit digits from longer serials so the radio call number would not exceed four digits.
This is just a basic over view - this subject could easily be covered by a short monograph one day...
Cheers,
Dana
I wrote this a while back, but I think it answers your question:
This is going to have to be the short version of this story. The serial-number-based radio call numbers were introduced by the Chief of the Air Corps on 28 November 1939 in Circular 100-4 (released by none other than LtCol Ira C. Eaker). This radio call number would be ordered applied as a tail marking on 28 October 1941, though it took some time to apply.
Each aircraft's serial number comprised the last two digits of the fiscal year in which the aircraft was ORDERED and an individual, sequential serial. Since most aircraft didn't last more than ten years (more below) the first digit would be dropped. The radio call had to comprise four digits, so that ground stations hearing only three digits would understand that the transmission had broken up. If the radio call was only two or three digits, zeros were to be inserted to make four digits. Thus 38-3 became 8003 and 39-24 became 9024.
The first problem was that Circular 100-4 did not understand the nature of the FY serial number, insisting that the first two digits represented "the year in which the airplane was manufactured." An aircraft manufactured in 1937, but not ordered by the Army until FY 1938 would be a problem, as would an aircraft ordered in FY 1940 but not delivered until 1941. You'll find a heap of errors on the tails of various aircraft, but the mistake came from painters following faulty instructions.
I noted that most aircraft would serve less than ten years, but some lasted much longer. In those cases, the radio call was to be preceded by the letter "O" (not another zero). Thus, serial 25-326 was to be identified as O-5326 "Oh-Five-Three-Two-Six" after 1934.
Note that some manufacturers would occassionally omit digits from longer serials so the radio call number would not exceed four digits.
This is just a basic over view - this subject could easily be covered by a short monograph one day...
Cheers,
Dana
- Thread starter
- #6
Well that's a LOT of information, thanks! I found a source that gave lists of actual assigned numbers, and it gave for example 44-00001, the 1st of the ones assigned for that order year, as being an A-20H. Four leading zeroes, then the 1. When it got to the 10th of that year, the number of leading zeroes went down to three. When it got to the 100th of that year, just two leading zeroes. The 1,000th of that year, one leading zero. I didn't know all that about Eaker though, and having been in the aviation maintenance side of things briefly myself, I can easily believe that mistakes come from "faulty instructions" - I used to write repair instructions, and I cringe to think what the poor guys in the shop must have thought of my work!
- Thread starter
- #7
One thing I noticed in a cockpit photo of the XP-67 is that its radio call is shown as the full serial number, "42-11677" rather than a 4-digit one.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
This is the given aircraft call sign based on it's serial number (as mentioned by Dana). It is basic and generic. When flown operationally a unique call sign may be used instead. Mission call signs are pretty formal these days and have significant meaning. IIRC during WW2 call signs were individual or mission based.
"Keyworth Blue" 61st FS - "Keyworth Blue Leader" - Frank Gabreski. "Daddy Flight" Mission call sign used on McGuire's last mission.
hawkeye2an
Staff Sergeant
Not sure what I am doing wrong but I can no longer access this through the aerofiles web page. I know that it changed hands after Joe died. Any help with how to get at this?
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
I have no trouble accessing Joe's site via the links posted above or by going to the main serial number index:
USASC-USAAS-USAAC-USAAF-USAF Military Aircraft Serial Numbers--1908 to Present
fubar57
General
Same as Dave
drgondog
Major
I didn't know Baugher had passed. RIP.
Over the years I passed Joe more than 100 corrections based on MACR and accident reports that he never incorporated.. Never understood why.
Over the years I passed Joe more than 100 corrections based on MACR and accident reports that he never incorporated.. Never understood why.
Snautzer01
Honourably banned
- 42,943
- Mar 26, 2007
Me too. Answered the e mails i sent him though. Think that database was maintaned by another guy.
His site is up so i wonder.
special ed
2nd Lieutenant
- 5,662
- May 13, 2018
Re: Short serial numbers, check out post 30 on the P-36 thread. P-36A 38-2 painted on data panel.
hawkeye2an
Staff Sergeant
Thanks for that link I could not access from the main page
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
You're welcome.
Not sure why you're having difficulties, but then again, the internet can be a pain the the...
Anyway, just in case you need them, here's Joe's USN/USMC BuNo page:
US Navy and US Marine Corps Military Aircraft Serial Numbers and Bureau Numbers--1911 to Present
And his USCG BuNo page:
US Coast Guard Aircraft Serials
hawkeye2an
Staff Sergeant
thanks, added these to my favorites. I don't need them often, but VERY handy when I do. Just doing a bit of research on a Missouri Guard L-19 image that is on display just outside Jefferson City. L-19 over flooded farm fields and no info on it, not even year. Now I know it was from the 129th Field Artillery and had to be 1952 as that was the only flood year before it crashed in 1954. Now to the library to see what I can come up with.
