Arado Ar 240/440

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by paradoxguy, Aug 15, 2013.

  1. paradoxguy

    paradoxguy Member

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    I apologize if this has been addressed in previous discussions--for the past week, when I use the search function, I receive an error message. The little information I have been able to find on the Arado Ar 240 and Ar 440 suggests these heavy fighter types had a high top speed (one source cites the Ar 440 with a max speed of 440 mph), as well as advanced features such as pressurised cockpits. However, they were not put into production. Did the Arados have performance deficiencies or did their performance not exceed the Messerschmitt Bf 110 and Me 410 enough to warrant their production and use?

    Thanks for your attention and any information.
     
  2. l'Omnivore Sobriquet

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    The Arado 240/440 had problems of behaviour at low speeds, especially on landing.
     
  3. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    I have the Arado 240 at 454 mph and the Arado 440 at 464 mph. According to what I read, the 240 had bad handling characteristics. The 440 was stretched by 35.5 inches, just under 1 meter, and apparently did not cure the handling woes.

    But the speed was so good I'm surprised they didn't pursue a handling cure. Of course, the handling woes aren't described, but stretching the fuselage indicate yaw issues ... if I were to extrapolate. Without data, though, it's just a guess and we'd need more to make anything like an informed opinion.

    So I'm with you ... I don't know but think they should have pursued the type a bit farther.
     
  4. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    It appears to me Me-110 had superior climb and probably superior maneuverability (i.e. lower wing loading) when both aircraft were powered by similar engines. Me-110 already had a proven track record as night fighter and recon aircraft.

    Ju-88A and Me-210C/Me-410A were probably superior dive bombers.

    If developed to production status what role would Ar-240 perform?
     
  5. paradoxguy

    paradoxguy Member

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    I greatly appreciate the responses and discussion. GregP, the speeds you cited were even higher than I had read. Dave, the high speeds of the Ar 240/440 caught my attention and I thought if the other performance parameters were satisfactory--but handling appears to have been less than--the Ar 240/440 could have supplanted the Bf 110 and Me 410 in the heavy fighter role, and perhaps served as a high-performance nightfighter as well.
     
  6. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    To me the vertical tails look way undersized, but I haven/t seen any areas or moments, so it is tough to say. Handling woes can usually be corrected and the only reason I was interested is the speed. It was far and away faster than the Bf 110 or the Ju 88 ... it was faster than the Mosquito that Herman Goering was so upset about.

    Since the Germans couldn't find and shoot down most Mosquitoes, it follows they could have used the Ar 240 / 440 in the same manner against the UK ... but they went and CANCELLED it. Doesn't make sense to me.
     
  7. Civettone

    Civettone Active Member

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    Apparently, the Ar 240C and Ar 440 were free of most of the handling issues.

    I believe the main role of the Arado was long-range recon: its superior speed would have made it very difficult to intercept.
    Second, I think that, if taken into production, it would have been modified into a night fighter. Not sure how it would have handled, but it had amazing performance.

    In the end, it had been bypassed by the Bf 110 and Me 410, which were already in production. A shame really.

    Kris
     
  8. razor1uk

    razor1uk Well-Known Member

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    Not much within the ego political man vs man system of the Natzi's does make sence Greg; exigencies of production costs, political opinions, RLM Tech Amt personalities opinions, development time and expected in-wider-service date (than say in one test unit) possibly also had a role in the abandonment of the 240/440 - also Arado did a lot of contracted out production for other manufacturers too AFAIK.
     
  9. Juha

    Juha Well-Known Member

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    Ar 240
    proto for 240A with DB 601Es, max speed 605km/h at 6000m, 240A-03 with DB 603A 668km/h at 6400m, protos for 240B with DB 605A-1s, Eric Brown flew one, calculated that its TAS was 360mph at 20,000ft and that it had extremely poor, potentially dangerous flight characteristics. Arado's figures were 614km/h at 6000m. RLM decided in May/June 42 that using the Ar 240 as temporary high speed bomber was out of question. Oberst Rowehl also rejected its use as a recon platform. Milch however allowed the construction of 240B-0s to continue as well as development work on the 240 with DB 603 for a while. But on 6 Nov 42 the entire contract for the 240 was suspended. And yes 240C proto solvted the handling problems, but too late.

    Juha
     
  10. Civettone

    Civettone Active Member

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    I just recalled that it had most interesting dive brakes ... installed near the tail section.




    Kris
     
  11. razor1uk

    razor1uk Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't the dive brakes a vertical split tail end type? ...like the Na.39's (Buccaneer's)
     
  12. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    Ar-440 was a late war aircraft which lost flight competition to Do-335. In this particular case I think RLM made the right decision. Do-335 had superior aerial performance and was free of bad handling characteristics.
     
  13. Civettone

    Civettone Active Member

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    I have my doubts about that. The Ar 440 flew in 1942 and was cancelled in 1943. The Do 335 only entered service in 1945.

    Of course, the Ar 440 would never have been built anyway: no DB 603G ever entered service.

    It would have been the Ar 240C with DB 603A engines. It was orderd into production in March 1943, but cancelled because the Me 410 was already entering service. I think this was a wise decision. The Ar 240C may have been superior, but in wartime, you need to have aircraft right away.

    Kris
     
  14. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    U.S. Strategic Bombing Survey Aircraft Division Industry Report
    149 DB603 engines were produced during March 1943. Even if the entire production were reserved for Ar-240C that amounts to about 50 aircraft plus a few spare engines.

    Doesn't sound realistic to me. Especially when other aircraft programs such as Fw-190C and Me-309 would like those same DB603 engines.
     
  15. Denniss

    Denniss Active Member

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    Ar 240/440 were also designed to fit the Zerstörer and night fighter role. I doubt a fully equipped (combat trim) 240/440 would be way faster than the Me 410.
     
  16. Civettone

    Civettone Active Member

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    Dave, what on earth are you talking about? You have been taking too much about what-if scenarios that you have lost your sense of reality ;) ;) jk, but seriously, there were no Fw 190C or Me 309s produced, so what is the problem?

    If the Ar 240C would have been chosen for production, it would have taken over the Me 410 production lines. No need for extra DB 603s. In fact, production would have temporariy been halted, given excess DB 603s.

    Kris
     
  17. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    No Ar-240Cs produced either and for the same reason. DB603 engine production was far too low to meet demand.
     
  18. Civettone

    Civettone Active Member

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    Oohh okay, got it now.
    But like I said, the Ar 240C would be produced instead of the Me 410.

    I wonder what it would have been like as a night fighter. Maybe finally the long awaited Mosquito killer?? :)

    Kris
     
  19. Clayton Magnet

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    Forgive my ignorance, but what big advantage would an Ar 440 have over a Me 410? Little to choose as far as top speed, and I've always thought the 2 mg131 in remote control barbettes was cool and innovative.
     
  20. davebender

    davebender Well-Known Member

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    #20 davebender, Aug 17, 2013
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2013
    Long awaited by who?

    Germany needed night fighter aircraft to fly in RAF bomber streams and hack down Lancaster bombers. Me-110G and Ju-88G worked just fine in that role.

    BTW, if you are absolutely determined to kill high flying pathfinder aircraft there's no need for a new aircraft type. Daimler-Benz developed several DB603 variants with turbochargers. Put one of these high altitude engines into limited production and use them to power a Gruppe of specially designated Ju-88G anti-pathfinder aircraft.
     
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