Best Medium-light tank

Shortround6 said:

Why don't you critique the German ordnance dept for some of their less than steller designs, like the 37mm HE round, the provision of a tear gas pellet in the base of the 7.92 Anti-tank rifle bullet and others.

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Because these failings, if you really think so (what was problem with 37mm HE round?) were insignicant compared to the importance of the defective 76mm AP and HE shells. Really, how one can say the importance of a 5 rounds of special (perhaps somewhat naive designed) rifle ammo issued to German infantry, that would be used against occasional armored cars etc. equals the importance that US Tank Destroyers simply couldnt do their job proper against common enemy heavy tanks (Panther, Tiger)...?

Frankly only German ordonance that does not make much sense is the 12.8 cm AT gun - when they had excellent PaK 43 already, 12.8 was a not very usable, and poinltess overkill..

I agree that US ordonance was generally good. Say 105mm infantry howitzer, 60mm mortar was excellent. Other systems, like adoption of the old 75mm French guns, WW1 BARs and Browning MGs were typically mediocre, but at least worked enough well. But the 76 mm was high profile mistake.

How come US 76mm shells were defective?? Why would medium powered (NOT the German KwK-42, nor british 17pdr) 3in class AP gun+ammo be that effective vs. heavy tank? German 7,5cm L43 to L48 were as '(in)effective vs. soviet 45-ton tanks as the US 3in or British 77mm vs. Panther*; asking from such kind of guns to defeat a 58-ton tank looks pretty far from reality, something along asking from 3,7cm to defeat T-34 or Sherman.
The only failing of 3in in US service was that it was not available in better numbers.

Under German ordnance that makes hardly any sense we could include both Tigers JagdTiger.

*IMO German 7,5cm guns (those weaker than Panther's gun) were at even greater disadvantage vs. IS-2, since that one was carrying more armor than Panther.

Tante Ju said:

Because these failings, if you really think so (what was problem with 37mm HE round?) were insignicant compared to the importance of the defective 76mm AP and HE shells. Really, how one can say the importance of a 5 rounds of special (perhaps somewhat naive designed) rifle ammo issued to German infantry, that would be used against occasional armored cars etc. equals the importance that US Tank Destroyers simply couldnt do their job proper against common enemy heavy tanks (Panther, Tiger)...?

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The only problem the German 37mm tank/anti tank shell had was it's low HE capacity of 25 grams, in part because of a large tracer element? Since Mr. Bender seems to believe that lower than average HE content is a crime or near crime for allied authorities why not for the German ones?
The normal German 7.9mm rifle/MG round is not in question evn in AP form. The bullet in question is for the high velocity 7.9mm anti-tank rifles. The tear gas component was about the size of an aspirin tablet and the idea that even multiple penetrations ( from single shot rifles) could actually drive a crew from their vehicle due the effect of the gas seems laughable. British were only aware of it when breaking down captured ammunition for examination.


The adoption of the 76mm was not a mistake if all factors are taken into account. The delay in it's production and service probably was. One factor glossed over is that while less powerful than the British 17pdr. The 76mm had about double the rate of fire as installed in the tank. The 76mm allowed for more stored ammo. The new turret with the 76mm fit with a minimum of modification onto the existing hull and, indeed, it may have possible to fit into the old turret at depots. The US passed over the uber velocity 75/76 in favor of the 90mm gun (much like the 88/56) which would have been much harder to fit in a Sherman chassis in a closed turret, it was fitted in an open topped turret That also required the sacrifice of a co-ax MG and limited ammo storage.

I always thought that the main problem with the German 37mm was the same as the US 37mm and the British 2pd. They were to damn small to do what they were needed to do after 1941, namely destroy tanks at a decent combat range.

Both 37 mm guns saw considerable use as infantry support guns after their best days as AT weapons were behind them. A number of German half- tracks mounted them, usually described as platoon leader vehicles.

Being outmoded doesn't mean a weapon was defective or badly designed. Having short comings in it's intended role at the time of it's introduction ( or for a while after) does raise questions though. Like having bad transmissions in tanks.