Bomber escort tactics questions

[Freebird]

And to borrow from drgondog; Then go visit all the families.

I would hope that any commander would do that.

To be honest though, it's not that different than the type of mision that the Blenheims DID do in 41, the low level attacks on shipping along the coast and other type of missions were brutal on the crews. The missions that the Battles were sent on was even worse, almost hopeless.

Alot of what the Brit's did early in the war smacks of desparation, often for little point, and not much recognition of the valient airmen sailors.

 

[Colin1]

...it's not that different than the type of mission that the Blenheims DID do in 41, the low level attacks on shipping along the coast and other type of missions were brutal on the crews. The missions that the Battles were sent on were even worse, almost hopeless.

Alot of what the Brits did early in the war smacks of desperation...

Bear in mind the '41 missions were tactical
the planes went in low and hard and once. The mission you set out for us sounded more like a strategic bombing run, if they're tied to the bombers and the bombers are holding steady then they're at the same risk as the bombers. Bringing them lower to cater for the Tomahawks lower ceiling simply brings the flak more firmly into the equation; whatever the losses in the tactical missions, they would have been far worse for your scenario. It is entirely feasible that a Blenheim force would have been annihilated.

Alot of what everybody did early in the war smacked of desperation, Europe got lax after 'the war to end all wars' (World War I), nobody was truly prepared for World War II and Hitler knew it. We all finally learned our lesson after the close of WWII and largely, that's why NATO was inaugurated.

 

[Glider]

I would get my hand on every Beaufighter and Whirlwind I could, leave the Blenhiem behind and the bombers would be Sterlings.

 

[HoHun]

Hi Freebird,

>Something vital to be sure. Perhaps a string of invasion barges with a Panzer division aboard, heading for the UK coast. If the bombers don't get through it will be a major disaster

Hm, the bad thing is that the Luftwaffe pilots will be aware of this too, so resistance might be even stiffer than I feared ...

>Consider the twins to be Beau's, not Blenhiems. There are only a dozen P-40's and perhaps 18 Beau's. The enemy has pehaps 20 Me109's and 16 x Me110's.

OK, that's a fairly potent force. I'd send in a small force of Hampdens escorted by the P-40s as first wave at medium altitude, and then the Wellingtons covered by the Beaufighters as second wave at a higher altitude. The first wave will be met by well-organized forces, so the faster bombers escorted by the more manoeuvrable and faster fighters will go in first, giving them a better chance to survival especially after the second wave arrives as the enemy probably will lose interest in a chase after the first wave has dropped its bombs.

The Beaufighters can survive attacks by Luftwaffe fighters for a while (until they get pushed down to sea level), and they will be able to tie up a good part of the defenders, taking the pressure off the bombers. The P-40s of the first wave will hopefully be able to climb back to altitude after disengaging from the target to support the withdrawal of the second wave.

We're still going to suffer bad losses as the Luftwaffe fighters outnumber and outperform us, but at least with the new order it's not the charge of the light brigade anymore

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

 

[Freebird]

Send the Blenheims down low in front of the bomber force to engage the flak units, which may also take away some of the enemy fighter force to go after them.

Were the Blenheims more effective bombing ships at low level than a 4 engine Halifax or Stirling making a high level attack?

Were they more manouverable than a Hampden or Wellington?

I'm just wondering if they used the Blenheims to attack the Japanese carriers because there was nothing else available?

 

[Glider]

In many ways the Wellington was the best the UK had for attacking ships as they carried two torpedo's on operational missions. On a low straight run in for a torpedo drop the quad 303 turret was probably as good as there was as a defence weapon in the time we are talking about.
I mentioned the Sterling as a bomber because it was available and carried by the standards of late 1940 early 1941 a significant bombload. It was also quite agile for a four engined bomber but sucked at altitude. So I would chose the bomber for the mission, Wellington for ships at sea, Sterling for most other missions.

I don't know why people are not going for the Whirlwind as a fighter, the Blenhiem was a death trap lacking everything by comparison, speed, agility, handling, firepower, you name it the Blenhiem lacked it.

For the first wave I would use the Beaufighter, it didn't carry rockets or torpedoas in this time frame but with some imagination a couple of bombs could be slung underneath.

 

[Freebird]

I don't know why people are not going for the Whirlwind as a fighter, the Blenhiem was a death trap lacking everything by comparison, speed, agility, handling, firepower, you name it the Blenhiem lacked it.

The Whirlwind was indeed an awesome aircraft, it lacked only perhaps in range. Speed and agility comparable to a single engine fighter

I was just curious to see what tactics people would use for slower, less agile twins vs. fighters if they were all that was available.

 

[MikeGazdik]

Were the Blenheims more effective bombing ships at low level than a 4 engine Halifax or Stirling making a high level attack?

Were they more manouverable than a Hampden or Wellington?

I'm just wondering if they used the Blenheims to attack the Japanese carriers because there was nothing else available?

I don't know. I was just trying to come up with a strategy utilizing some of the aircraft already put into the game by previous posts. My main reason for sending the Blenheims in low level was to suppress the flak guns, which will be even more deadly with the main bomber force at the lower altitude I was sending them to make thier Tomahawk escorts more effective. Unfortunately the Blenheims seem to stand little chance in either duty. I would rather have them at least occupy the flak gunners and possibly a few fighters, rather than get smoked with little or no contribution at the same altitude as the bomber force.

 

[Glider]

If we are talking early 1941 then the RAF could always try to get the Wildcats off the FAA or at least use those units on an RAF mission. It depends on the urgency and ability of Churchill to knock some heads together