**** DONE: 1/48 Polikarpov I-16 Type 18 - Winter War / Eastern Front WWII

Discussion in '#23 Winter War / Eastern Front WWII' started by fubar57, Aug 2, 2014.

  1. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    #1 fubar57, Aug 2, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 5, 2014
    User Name: fubar57
    Name: George
    Category: Advanced
    Kit: Eduard Weekend Edition
    Accessories: Some odds and ends

    002.JPG

    This model represents an aircraft from the 286th IAP, Leningrad area, 1942. I'll see if I can find a photo of the actual aircraft.

    Geo
     
  2. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    #2 Wurger, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
    Here is a profile of Tatarchuk's I-16 and his personal image.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The main problem is if the number 61 was yellow or white or red. The another I-16 of the squadron looked like that.. and here the colour of thenumber 30 was identified both as yellow and red. In my opinion it should be of red. If you look at the sky in the picture you will see clouds. It indicates that the yellow filter was used when taking the shot. In the case the yellow colour should have become of the very light tinge ( almost white ). But the number is of very dark colour , I would say of the same that was used for the red star.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  3. destrozas

    destrozas Well-Known Member

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    #3 destrozas, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
    in a this web you cab see the colour of VVS

    table of colors

    Camouflage and livery paints for Soviet aircraft 1937-June 1940

    the green is AII (zashchitnyi) gloss camouflage green, Akan 318, overall wooden, fabric (and eventually, metallic) uppersurfaces( I-15bis, I-16...),by info hobbyvista modelling the VVS research colours equivalence to FS 34066- 34062

    Camouflage and livery paints for Soviet aircraft June 1940 -July 1941

    AII Zashch. (zashchitnyi) gloss camouflage green, Akan 318, overall wooden, fabric (and eventually, metallic) uppersurfaces, equivalence to FS 34066- 34062


    some types of planes of late 1941 seem to show a low contrast on the camo. This could be due to the use of stocks of earlier greens, and to the painting of very thinned black over green background.
    Many Yaks seem to show a particularly high-contrasted camo. The reason is unclear. Someone hypothyzed the use of a lighter shade of green (ex. tractor green) or desert-style camos, but there is no any confirmation of this in documents and exhibits. Probably this high contrast is due to the use of only one layer of green instead of two over a yellowish primer/putty background, and to the use of sharp and well-covering black bands.
     
  4. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    #4 Wurger, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
    According to Geo's info above, it is I-16 type 18 used in 1942 at the Leningrad area. During the period of war the camo for fighter planes was of the AMT4/AMT6 at tops. The solid green ( khaki) colour scheme was the pre-war one and changed into the Green/Black one soon after the German invasion on Russia.

    The low and high contrast on Yaks might have been because there werre two tinges of the AII Green. The FS 24258 ( Humbrol 114 ( no longer available) or Testors 1571 eg.. .. and the FS 24062 - Humbrol 149 or Testors 1764 for instance . While the first Green is a light variant, the second one is the dark one.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Also I would like to make a focus on the pics of the Red 30 and the image with Tatarchuk in the cockpit.... Both images show small doors at the starboard. The door at the side appeared with the 24th and later variants of the I-16 fighter machine. So.. it indicates the type 24 . The I-16 type 18 had the door on the port side only.

    I-16 type 10...

    [​IMG]

    I-16 type 17...

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    #5 fubar57, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
    Sigh...Thanks Wojtek. The 30 is the same color as the star as well. As this is only one of two Soviet aircraft I have I'm kinda limited on numbers and I can't see paying 25$+ just for 4 numbers. Having said that, I just now read a review on this aircraft at the Hyperscale site which said it was actually Edwards Type 24 moldings and with a little bit of work, it could be made into a proper Type 18. Sooooooo, I'm going to search for a Type 24 with a Yellow 1, 6, 16, or 61 in the style I have and with the judges permission, I'll make the necessary edits. If I can't find anything I'll leave it as is and be wrong on the number colors. There seem to be more photos of Type 24 aircraft than of the 18.

    Geo

    EDIT: Sorry Wojtek, I never saw your last post as I was typing and crying softly to myself.
     
  6. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    No problemo my friend. To make the matter better it seems that there isn't any picture of the I-16 with the 61 number. So we can't confirm it was of different colour. Also the camo scheme is unknown to be honest. Looking at the profile I would say it was the Khaki colour with many traces of the refurbishing. But the Black/Green camo with these repair traces is possible too.
     
  7. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    I don't have many books on Soviet aircraft and these are the only two Type 24s I could find that would accommodate my resources. These are in winter camouflage and the lead aircraft looks like it has a yellow 1 on the tail...

    I-16 type 24.JPG1.jpg

    This profile has a red 1 which I'm sure I could make...

    I-16 type 24.jpg

    Anyhoo...here are the kits parts. Notice the very small potential pingers on the second set of sprues...

    004.JPG 005.JPG 006.JPG 007.JPG

    ...I'm hoping to get started shortly.

    Geo
     
  8. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    [​IMG]

    Unfortunately these I-16 type 24 of 1940 aren't in the winter camo. These are of the "The Red Fives" aerobatic team etablished in 1935. Planes were painted with a gloss , bright red overall with silver starts. Later, planes were painted in silver with black trimming.
     
  9. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    And here you are diagrams show the differences in the engine cowling between the type 18 and 24..

    type 18
    [​IMG]

    type 24
    [​IMG]
     
  10. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    OK..crep...back to the Type 18 then. Fill in the starboard door, remove the radio hatch on the starboard side and Bob's my uncle. As for the photo of the "Red Fives", I will never forgive Yefim Gordon and Dmitri Khazanov for deceiving me in their book "Soviet Combat Aircraft of the Second World War" Volume one. At this stage of the game, I'll just make a generic aircraft as either a yellow 1,6, or 16. Thank you for the link Sergio, it'll come in very handy. Wojtek, would it be correct to say that the aircraft would be more correctly painted as like the second aircraft in Post #7?

    Geo
     
  11. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    Yes it would. Of course it is the summer camo scheme.
     
  12. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    Alrighty then, thank you my friend. I'm going to use Tamiya Nato Black and will need to find approximates for the green and blue in Tamiya,for the technical reason being, that's all I have.

    Geo
     
  13. mikewint

    mikewint Well-Known Member

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    If you see a difference in 18 to 24 your eyes are better than mine and as for color I sincerely doubt anyone in the Russian Air force was part of the Цвет полиции.
     
  14. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    #14 fubar57, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014
    There's the few that I mentioned above and what wasn't mentioned in the review I was following, the front of the cowl is different as pointed out by Wojtek. Also, there is a difference with either a tail skid or wheel: the wheel used on later production run 18s and the 24s.

    Geo

    EDIT: Crep, just noticed as I was checking the sprues, I have the Type 24 cowl front as well, son of a....
     
  15. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    AII Goluboj - bright blue - FS 25466 - Tamiya XF-23

    AMT7/A-28M Goluboj - bright blue - FS25550/FS35250 - Humbrol 115,

    AII Zielonyj - Green - FS 24258 - Tamiya XF-13

    AII Tiomno Zielonyj - dark green - FS24062 - Tamiya X-05

    AMT4/A24M - Zielonyj - green - FS24151/FS34102 - Humbrol 151/117
     
  16. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    Your a wealth of information Wojtek. These colors..I have. So this is what they'll look like...

    i-16.JPG

    I just have to add the struts, antennae and decals to my other GB and I can start this one.

    Geo
     
  17. Crimea_River

    Crimea_River Well-Known Member

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    Good info here. Don't understand any of it but good info anyway!
     
  18. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    Looking good methinks.
     
  19. fubar57

    fubar57 Well-Known Member

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    It starts. Compared to what I am doing in GB22, this thing is almost microscopic and to be on the safe side, I'm going to remove the almost invisible pingers inside a plastic bag to avoid the inevitable. I have a clear bag, which is big enough so that I can assemble the cockpit parts to the fuselage because once I get them off the sprue tree, I will surely drop them. Inside the fuselage...

    002.JPG 003.JPG

    The first step for me is to remove the radio hatch and cockpit access door from the starboard side as the Type 18 didn't have them...

    007.JPG 009.JPG

    ...a finer grit sanding is still needed. My GB22 awaiting the struts to dry...

    004.JPG

    Geo
     
  20. Crimea_River

    Crimea_River Well-Known Member

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    Not much surface detail on that one is there..
     
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