Fiat CR.42 Falco....
- Thread starter Lucky13
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vikingBerserker
Lieutenant General
I love the 3rd one!
The closest I could get was #73 of 9 Gruppo.
The closest I could get was #73 of 9 Gruppo.
Now you've done it, Paul....those pics will get him going!!
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- #5
Lucky13
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Sure thing! But, just to be a pain in the neck, as I always am, the 13-85, that you can find in a not entirely unknown museum south of the border here, is a machine that was not going to do. 
Been looking at the Veltro 205 as well, as you can get that machine from Special Hobby with that "13" in the decalset and the '109......yummy!
Been looking at the Veltro 205 as well, as you can get that machine from Special Hobby with that "13" in the decalset and the '109......yummy!
DBII
Senior Master Sergeant
the 3rd bird is hot.
DBII
DBII
Civettone
Tech Sergeant
Is that last one a Beaufighter?
Kris
Kris
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Don't think it's a Blenheim, looks too big, and the turret looks like a Martin turret. I think it's either a Baltimore or a Maryland, possibly captured.
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- #10
Lucky13
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I'd put my money on a Baltimore bomber.....
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Just had a quick check. As the rudder is turned slightly, it looks slightly different. But it is the correct shape for a Martin machine, whereas the Blenheim's rudder was more pointed, had a leading edge 'step', and wasn't as tall. Also, the Blenheim had a sliding panel on top of the cockpit, and was wider, whereas here the hatch is hinged to starboard.The turret on the Blenheim was taller, and with a single Vickers, later twin Vickers or .303 Brownings. The turret here is definitely a Martin, single glazed cupola, mounting twin Browning .50 cals. The fuselage is also slimmer, and the underside curve to the bomb bay can just be discerned. The deciding factor, Baltimore or Maryland, are the engine nacelles. The Blenheims ended half way across the wing chord, whereas these extend beyond the wing trailing edge ( the Maryland's end at the wing trailing edge.) Finally, the pic shows a much larger, and taller aircraft. Definitely a Baltimore, used only in the Middle East by the RAF, RAAF and SAAF, although I believe there were also some in Free French and Greek service in that theatre.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Ah, yes. That's the early version, known as the Baltimore MkI in RAF service, used, AFAIK, only in OTI's/OCU's, along with around 100 MkII's., whereas the main equipment in the RAF MTO was the MkIII, which had the rudder mass balance, as in your first pic, to improve handling.
Civettone
Tech Sergeant
I can't believe I didn't notice the turret ...
Ah well, nice to see it's a Baltimore
Kris
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- #17
Lucky13
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Come to think about it....can't really do the CR.42 #13 from the 85 Squadriglia, that one saw service in the BoB right, and never in the MTO/North Africa.
Off to see if one can find another CR.42 #13....
Off to see if one can find another CR.42 #13....
B-17engineer
Colonel
Jan I have a book on WWII aircraft and I'll go take a look for you!
Give you an answer in 10 minutes. hehe
Give you an answer in 10 minutes. hehe
B-17engineer
Colonel
Just general info on the Falco in North Africa.....
In North Africa, the CR.42 was being pressed into service as a fighter bomber carrying a pair of 200lb bombs for the first time in combat after the reconquest of Libya in May 1941. Three Stormi were eventually equip with these aircraft and saw constant use until the final advanced on El Alamein. Typical targets were camps, vehicles, and air bases some sorties being flown by night. By January 1943 there were just 82 Falcos left in North Africa; these were evacuated to Italy and used to attack Allied convoys between Gibraltar and Malta, though there effectiveness was limited by the small size of the bombs they carried.
As you can see, not many Falcos were left in North Africa, maybe you can do further research on 85-13 and 95-13 and see if they were kept in service. The book I'm reading has profiles of the Falco, in Belgiums, Swedish, Hungarian, and German markings.
A little bit on it's Mediterranean service.
In North Africa the Falco was used the most, it still became clear it was no match for the Hurricane and Spitfire. Two Gruppi with CR.42's in Libya (Designated CR.42AS, for Africa Settentrionale, or North Africa.) were particularly active between June 1940 and February 1941, at the forefront of the offensive that culminated in the conquest of Sidi Barrani. For most of this period the most challenging opposition faced by Italian fighters came from the RAF Gloster Gladiators, though during 1941 the Allies went on to the offensive and the Hawker Hurricane began to enter service. Meanwhile, Falcos based in Sicily escorted the first Axis raids on Malta and, at the end of October 1940, the war against Greece began. The Italian invading forces including a Gruppo of CR.42's the aircraft and their pilots performing against inferior and ill equip Greek pilots during operations over difficult terrain and in bad weather. The Regia Aeronautica lost 29 aircraft of all types in the Greek campaign, claiming 160 kills in return. The conquest of Crete also saw Falcos escorting Ju-87 dive bombs.
In North Africa, the CR.42 was being pressed into service as a fighter bomber carrying a pair of 200lb bombs for the first time in combat after the reconquest of Libya in May 1941. Three Stormi were eventually equip with these aircraft and saw constant use until the final advanced on El Alamein. Typical targets were camps, vehicles, and air bases some sorties being flown by night. By January 1943 there were just 82 Falcos left in North Africa; these were evacuated to Italy and used to attack Allied convoys between Gibraltar and Malta, though there effectiveness was limited by the small size of the bombs they carried.
As you can see, not many Falcos were left in North Africa, maybe you can do further research on 85-13 and 95-13 and see if they were kept in service. The book I'm reading has profiles of the Falco, in Belgiums, Swedish, Hungarian, and German markings.
A little bit on it's Mediterranean service.
In North Africa the Falco was used the most, it still became clear it was no match for the Hurricane and Spitfire. Two Gruppi with CR.42's in Libya (Designated CR.42AS, for Africa Settentrionale, or North Africa.) were particularly active between June 1940 and February 1941, at the forefront of the offensive that culminated in the conquest of Sidi Barrani. For most of this period the most challenging opposition faced by Italian fighters came from the RAF Gloster Gladiators, though during 1941 the Allies went on to the offensive and the Hawker Hurricane began to enter service. Meanwhile, Falcos based in Sicily escorted the first Axis raids on Malta and, at the end of October 1940, the war against Greece began. The Italian invading forces including a Gruppo of CR.42's the aircraft and their pilots performing against inferior and ill equip Greek pilots during operations over difficult terrain and in bad weather. The Regia Aeronautica lost 29 aircraft of all types in the Greek campaign, claiming 160 kills in return. The conquest of Crete also saw Falcos escorting Ju-87 dive bombs.
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Lucky13
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Cheers Harrison, but I was thinking more of the particular aircraft at the museum, down south in England, which is the one that we'we seen pics of here, 85-13....
Thanks for the info though, good read!
Thanks for the info though, good read!
