Hurricane vs P-40

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by Marshall_Stack, Jul 22, 2008.

  1. Marshall_Stack

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2005
    Messages:
    393
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Occupation:
    Engineer
    Location:
    Missouri
    I was kind of surprised at the following statement in Wikipedia (or should I not be) in regards to the Hurricane...

    "Hurricanes served with several British Commonwealth squadrons in the Desert Air Force. They suffered heavy losses over North Africa after the arrival of Bf 109E and F-variants and were progressively replaced in the air superiority role from June 1941 by Curtiss Tomahawks/Kittyhawks. "

    I figured that the Hurricane and P-40 were about equal in terms of abilities. Is the Wikipedia statement true about P-40s being the replacement for the Hurricane?
     
  2. Jerry W. Loper

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    123
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Hurricanes in the desert probably actually had poorer performance than they had had in the Battle of Britain, especially if they were fitted with Volkes filters. While the F model of the Bf-109 was certainly far superior to the Hurricane, the E model was the same plane the Hurricane had faced in the summer of 1940; why would the E model have more of an advantage than it had had a year or two before? In another thread, somebody wrote that speed topped the list of important things for a fighter, and a Hurricane with a Volkes filter was probably 40 or 50 m.p.h. slower than a P-40B Tomahawk (352 m.p.h.).
     
  3. claidemore

    claidemore Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2008
    Messages:
    682
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    My understanding is that the Volkes filters on the Hurricanes had much less of an impact on performance than they did on the Spitfire Mk V. I remember this being pointed out in another thread about the performance of Hurricanes in PTO.

    Performance degradation from tropical filters notwithstanding, the Hurricane would still be slower than any model of P40. Hence the preferance for P40 and Spitfire MkV for fighter vs fighter roles in North Africa. Hurricanes were still used in fighter/bomber and ground attack roles though, right up to the end of the desert campaign.

    The E models of 109 in North Africa would of course be the later ones, (E4s E7s, including some DB601N high alt engine versions) which would be higher performing than the E1s, E3s and some E4s which were the primary types the Hurris faced in BoB.
     
  4. Vincenzo

    Vincenzo Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    2,281
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    none
    Location:
    Lazio
    and i add the tropicalized emil loss less
     
  5. kool kitty89

    kool kitty89 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,069
    Likes Received:
    36
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Why didn't the P-40 (or other US aircraft for that matter) use tropical/sand filters?
     
  6. Vincenzo

    Vincenzo Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2007
    Messages:
    2,281
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    none
    Location:
    Lazio
    afaik the p-40 used filters
     
  7. claidemore

    claidemore Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2008
    Messages:
    682
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    British and German planes were designed for the climtes in those countries, while US planes tended to be designed to meet the various climate conditions which exist in the continental US, which includes tropical (Florida) and desert (Southwest California).
    With the MkVIII and MkIX Spitfires, a good filter design was finally found which worked in all climates.
    Basically the Volkes filter was just a poor design, many desert Spitfire MkVs had Aboukir filters installed, which Egyption RAF maintenance units designed and produced. While it did not add the terrible performance reduction of the Volkes filter it also did not give as much protection to the engine. A better solution from the pilots POV, not as good from the POV of the British government paying for new engines!

    The Merlin is so often stated as an engine with tight tolerences, yet my Uncle, who was a Merlin tech with RCAF (411 Squadron) maintained that he was always amazed at how "loose" the tolerences were for the Merlin. (Mind you, before and after the war he worked on diesel engines, so he was comparing the Merlin to them.)
     
Loading...
Similar Threads
  1. gjs238
    Replies:
    97
    Views:
    15,672
  2. Clay_Allison
    Replies:
    68
    Views:
    9,697
  3. Elvis
    Replies:
    274
    Views:
    49,981
  4. V-1710
    Replies:
    28
    Views:
    21,813
  5. DerAdlerIstGelandet
    Replies:
    370
    Views:
    44,915

Share This Page