IS THIS A JOKE?!? NCO PILOTS?!?!?

Discussion in 'Modern' started by FLYBOYJ, Jun 19, 2007.

  1. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    Maybe some of folks currently serving could verify this.

    US Navy Starts Accepting Enlisted Sailors for Chief Warrant Officer Pilot, Flight Officer Training
    RAAUZYUW RUENAAA0005 0191820-UUUU--RUCRNAD.

    ZNR UUUUU ZUI RUEWMCS1734 0191824

    R 191820Z JAN 06 ZYB MIN ZYW PSN 793597K40

    FM CNO WASHINGTON DC//N1NT//

    TO NAVADMIN

    RHMFIUU/CNO WASHINGTON DC//N1NT//

    RUENAAA/CNO WASHINGTON DC//N1NT//

    BT

    UNCLAS //N01500//

    NAVADMIN 031/06

    MSGID/GENADMIN/CNO WASHINGTON DC/N1NT/JAN//

    SUBJ/FY-06 ACTIVE DUTY FLYING CHIEF WARRANT OFFICER (CWO) PILOT /PROGRAM APPLICATION//

    GENTEXT/REMARKS/1. THE NAVY IS SEEKING APPLICATIONS FROM HIGHLY-QUALIFIED AND HARD-CHARGING SAILORS (E-5 THROUGH E-7) FOR A PILOT PROGRAM TO PLACE CHIEF WARRANT OFFICERS (CWO) IN COCKPITS AS PILOTS AND NAVAL FLIGHT OFFICERS. AS PART OF CNO'S STRATEGY FOR OUR PEOPLE, THIS PILOT PROGRAM WILL HARNESS THE STRENGTHS OF OUR SAILORS TODAY AND SHAPE THE NAVY OF TOMORROW. AS A PILOT PROGRAM, 30 QUALIFIED PERSONNEL WILL BE SELECTED, COMMISSIONED AS CWO2 PRIOR TO LDO/CWO INDOCTRINATION, AND SUBSEQUENTLY UNDERGO FLIGHT TRAINING.

    2. THE NEWLY WINGED AVIATORS WILL RECEIVE FLEET REPLACEMENT SQUADRON (FRS) TRAINING AND THEN REPORT TO THE FLEET. TARGETED COMMUNITIES ARE VP, VQ (P), VQ (T), HSC, AND HSL. THE INTENT IS TO CREATE FLYING SPECIALISTS UNENCUMBERED BY THE TRADITIONAL CAREER PATHS OF THE UNRESTRICTED LINE (URL) COMMUNITY. AS SUCH, FLYING CWO'S WILL ROTATE BETWEEN TRADITIONAL SEA/SHORE ROTATIONS (OPERATIONAL SQUADRONS TO SHORE PRODUCTION SOURCES, E.G. TRACOM, FRS, NSAWC, WEAPON SCHOOLS). APPLICATIONS ARE DUE TO COMNAVPERSCOM (PERS-432M) NO LATER THAN 31MAR06.

    3. SPECIFIC PROGRAM REQUIREMENTS:

    A. MUST BE COMMISSIONED BY 27TH BIRTHDAY.

    B. ENLISTED PERSONNEL FROM SEAL, SWCC, EOD, DIVER, NUCLEAR, AND MA COMMUNITIES ARE NOT ELIGIBLE FOR THIS PROGRAM.

    C. MUST POSSESS AN ASSOCIATES DEGREE OR HIGHER.

    D. MUST BE PHYSICALLY QUALIFIED FOR AVIATION DUTY IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE NAVY MANUAL OF MEDICINE.

    E. MUST MEET AVIATION STANDARD TEST BATTERY (ASTB) MINIMUMS.

    F. MUST MEET ELIGIBILITY REQUIREMENT FOR A SECRET SECURITY CLEARANCE.

    4. INDIVIDUAL CAREER CONSIDERATIONS:

    A. UPON WINGING, SELECTEES WILL INCUR AN 8 YR MINIMUM SERVICE REQUIREMENT (MSR) FOR PILOTS, 6 YR MSR FOR NAVAL FLIGHT OFFICERS.

    B. TOUR LENGTHS: SEA 36 MONTHS, SHORE 33 MONTHS.

    C. ELIGIBLE ASSIGNMENTS: VP, VQ (P), VQ (T), HSC, HSL AND ASSOCIATED FRS, TRACOM, NSAWC, AND WEAPON SCHOOLS.

    D. SELECTEES ARE NOT ELIGIBLE FOR DEPARTMENT HEAD (DH) TOURS AND WILL FILL JUNIOR OFFICER (JO) BILLETS ONLY. THE INTENT IS FOR FLYING CHIEF WARRANT OFFICERS NOT TO FILL JO BILLETS THAT ARE NORMALLY CONSIDERED CAREER MILESTONES FOR URL OFFICERS.

    E. ORDERS WILL BE NEGOTIATED WITH THE COGNIZANT PERS-43 ASSIGNMENTS OFFICER.

    5. ATTRITION:

    A. ATTRITES EITHER IN THE TRAINING COMMAND, FRS OR FLEET THAT HAVE LESS THAN 3 YEARS OF COMMISSIONED SERVICE WILL REVERT BACK TO THEIR PREVIOUS RANK AND RATE.

    B. THOSE IN EXCESS OF 3 YEARS COMMISSIONED SERVICE WILL BE DETAILED TO NON-FLYING BILLETS WITHIN THE AVIATION COMMUNITY.

    6. REFER TO THE OPNAVINST 1420.1A FOR CWO ELIGIBILITY CRITERIA IN ADDITION TO REQUIREMENTS CITED IN PARAGRAPH 3. INDIVIDUAL GRADE AND TIME-IN-SERVICE WAIVERS FOR E-5/E-6 PERSONNEL ARE NOT REQUIRED. A GROUP GRADE AND TIME-IN-SERVICE WAIVER FOR E-5/E-6 PERSONNEL IN THE PILOT PROGRAM WILL BE SUBMITTED BY PERS-4.

    7. APPLICATIONS SHOULD INCLUDE FLIGHT PHYSICAL DOCUMENTATION, ASTB RESULTS, AND SECURITY CLEARANCE ELIGIBILITY. SAMPLE APPLICATION WITH ANSWERS TO FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS IS ALSO AVAILABLE AT LDO/CWO Community, CLICK ON THE NEWS TAB.

    FOR ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ON THE FLYING CWO PROGRAM, CONTACT THE HEAD AVIATION PLACEMENT OFFICER, CDR STEVEN KNOTT AT (901) 874-4944/DSN 882 OR ASSISTANT LDO/CWO ASSIGNMENTS OFFICER LCDR AL WOOTEN AT (901) 874-3948/DSN 882. FOR APPLICATION QUESTIONS CONTACT COMNAVPERSCOM (PERS-4801G) CWO2 MCGALLAGHER OR MR. DAWSON AT (901) 874-3172/DSN 882 OR EMAIL AT [email protected].

    8. RELEASED BY VADM J. C. HARVEY, JR., N1/NT.//
     
  2. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    41,768
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A&P - Aircraft Technician
    Location:
    USA/Germany
    Yes but when they complete there training they become warrant officers. They do the same thing in the Army as well. 90 percent of my pilots were prior enlisted who applied for Warrant Officer Flight Training. Upon selection they go to Warrant Officer Candidate School for 6 weeks and then after graduation from that they report to Flight School as WO1's.

    Infact most pilots in the Army were prior enlisted...
     
  3. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA

    That I knew Chris, for the Army, but would never believe the Navy would do the same thing.
     
  4. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    41,768
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A&P - Aircraft Technician
    Location:
    USA/Germany
    Why not? Rank does not make the man...
     
  5. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    You are very correct. I've always felt there was nothing wrong with enlisted pilots.
     
  6. twoeagles

    twoeagles Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2006
    Messages:
    682
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Occupation:
    Aeronautical engineer and Navy Dad
    Location:
    Chambersburg
  7. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    "D. SELECTEES ARE NOT ELIGIBLE FOR DEPARTMENT HEAD (DH) TOURS
    AND WILL FILL JUNIOR OFFICER (JO) BILLETS ONLY. THE INTENT IS FOR
    FLYING CHIEF WARRANT OFFICERS NOT TO FILL JO BILLETS THAT ARE
    NORMALLY CONSIDERED CAREER MILESTONES FOR URL OFFICERS."

    "FLYING CHIEF WARRANT OFFICERS" I like that! :evil4:
     
  8. twoeagles

    twoeagles Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2006
    Messages:
    682
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Occupation:
    Aeronautical engineer and Navy Dad
    Location:
    Chambersburg
    ...all the flying with none of the other career path B.S. Sweet!!!!
     
  9. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    13,090
    Likes Received:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Platonic Sphere
    well Joe just like WW 2.

    Unteroffiziers, Feldwebels in the Luftwaffe, some of the best Reich defense pilots offered. Even a few corporals didn't do so bloody awful at all with several kills to their credit. so are we going back to times of old ?
     
  10. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    Yep!

    Agree 100%

    I mentioned this in an old post but when I was in the reserve I took an aeroclub T-34 (Edwards AFB) and flew it to point Mugu for an airshow. My division Chief allowed this to count as a drill weekend if I paid for the plane (between my pay and the rental price it actually balanced out). Our XO saw me inside the "participant's tent" and asked why I was there. When I told him he had a puzzled look on his face. "What's a matter sir, you don't think enlisted guys could fly an airplane, are we worried about job security?" He didn't think that was very nice and actually avoided ever talking to me again! :evil4:
     
  11. timshatz

    timshatz Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2006
    Messages:
    4,441
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    MGR
    Location:
    Phila, Pa
    Bumped into the occasional "0" who had that kind of attitude. Looking down their nose at you. Not the better officers either. Usually average.

    The Navy had enlisted pilots prior to WW2. Phased them out after a year or two of the war. Bringing them back is not such a bad idea. Bang for the buck is good and all they have to do is fly. Little or no paperwork. As Adler noted, the Army has mostly enlisted pilots and that works very well.
     
  12. pbfoot

    pbfoot Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2005
    Messages:
    7,636
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    niagara falls
    Great about time I wish our military would take the same path .
     
  13. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    You guys would look great - Sgt. Stripes on that uniform - just like WW2!!
     
  14. pbfoot

    pbfoot Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2005
    Messages:
    7,636
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    niagara falls
    I think how it started in the RCAF was WW2 that sometimes the pilot was a Flight Sergeant and if others in his crew were officers it was hard to mingle in the different messes which P...off most of the crews paricularly siince most of the ADMIN types who made the rules were Brits
     
  15. FLYBOYJ

    FLYBOYJ "THE GREAT GAZOO"
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Messages:
    23,205
    Likes Received:
    787
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Aircraft Maintenance Manager/ Flight Instructor
    Location:
    Colorado, USA
    Those damn Brits! :evil4:
     
  16. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    41,768
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A&P - Aircraft Technician
    Location:
    USA/Germany
    Thats why most of the pilots in the army become Warrant Officers and not Officers, because they love flying.

    Officer Pilots in the Army fill the command roles. They fly for a few years and then they sit behind a desk and just get there minimums. Warrant Officers are the experienced ones in the Army because that is all they do is fly.
     
  17. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    41,768
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A&P - Aircraft Technician
    Location:
    USA/Germany
    A Warrant Officer is not really an enlisted soldier anymore. They are officers that recieve a warrant from Congress. They are addressed either as "Mr.", "Sir", "Miss" or "Maam" or "Chief" and are saluted as officers are.

    Deff of a Warrant Officer:

    In the United States military, a Warrant Officer is ranked as an officer above the senior-most enlisted ranks, as well as officer cadets and candidates, but below the grade of O-1 (NATO: OF-1). Warrant officers are highly skilled, single-track specialty officers, and while the ranks are authorized by Congress, each branch of the military selects, manages, and utilizes warrant officers in slightly different ways. Upon the initial appointment to Warrant Officer 1, a warrant is given by the secretary of the service, and upon promotion to Chief Warrant Officer 2, they are commissioned by the President of the United States, taking the same oath and receiving the same commission and charges as commissioned officers, thus deriving their authority from the same source.

    Warrant officers can and do command detachments, units, activities, vessels, aircraft, and armored vehicles as well as lead, coach, train, and counsel subordinates. However, the Warrant Officer's primary task as a leader is to serve as a technical experts, providing valuable skills, guidance, and expertise to commanders and organizations in their particular field.
    Warrant Officer (United States) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  18. renrich

    renrich Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2007
    Messages:
    4,542
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    real estate
    Location:
    Montrose, Colorado
    I think it is a good idea. A lot of billets available in the Navy that involve flying and my guess is that they are having a hard time filling them and KEEPING them filled.
     
  19. Wildcat

    Wildcat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    8,857
    Likes Received:
    376
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Workin' for the man....
    Location:
    South East Queensland
    Interesting you say that, I only just saw this piece of news yesterday.

    Aussie pilots to fill helicopter vacancies - Military News, Navy News, opinions, editorials, news from Iraq, photos, reports - Navy Times
     
  20. 102first_hussars

    102first_hussars Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2005
    Messages:
    2,214
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Occupation:
    Service Truck Driver For Fountain Tire's Farm And Fleet Service
    Location:
    Edmonton,Alberta
    I wish the C.A.F would take this kind of initiative, we need to find pilots somewhere
     
Loading...

Share This Page