Is This a Real Spitfire at 8:52 in the Video?
- Thread starter MIflyer
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- Thread starter
- #3
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
Well, when I oooked at it on Youtube it was at 8:52. I guess the 8:52 includes the commercials.
Going over on its nose?
I found this
It is a Spitfire PR XIX
The Spitfire Flipped over while trying to take off. The pilot was slightly injured but taken to hospital.
An 18-year-old woman on the public was injured on the shoulder by a projection (propeler blades) was transported to the hospital, and a 48-year-old man later complained of a trauma to her leg but was not transported to the hospital.
25-APR-2018 - BEA final report:
3 - LESSONS LEARNED AND CONCLUSION
A too fast flight line during the take-off roll led to the aircraft tipping forward and then overturning. The pilot was making his first flight on this aircraft, and his experience on other vintage aircraft was able to skew his approach to take off on a Spitfire.
A first flight on an aircraft carries a greater risk of accident, all the more so with a highly powered aircraft such as the Spitfire. Flights on Spitfire are infrequent(5) and opportunities to drop a pilot on this aircraft are rare. However, the decision to make a first flight on this type of aircraft did not take into account the significant increase in risk in the event of runway excursions or debris projections due to the presence of the public.
From
Crash Spitfire ( vidéo complète ) au décollage a l aérodrome de Villette-Longuyon 11/06/17
It is a Spitfire PR XIX
The Spitfire Flipped over while trying to take off. The pilot was slightly injured but taken to hospital.
An 18-year-old woman on the public was injured on the shoulder by a projection (propeler blades) was transported to the hospital, and a 48-year-old man later complained of a trauma to her leg but was not transported to the hospital.
25-APR-2018 - BEA final report:
3 - LESSONS LEARNED AND CONCLUSION
A too fast flight line during the take-off roll led to the aircraft tipping forward and then overturning. The pilot was making his first flight on this aircraft, and his experience on other vintage aircraft was able to skew his approach to take off on a Spitfire.
A first flight on an aircraft carries a greater risk of accident, all the more so with a highly powered aircraft such as the Spitfire. Flights on Spitfire are infrequent(5) and opportunities to drop a pilot on this aircraft are rare. However, the decision to make a first flight on this type of aircraft did not take into account the significant increase in risk in the event of runway excursions or debris projections due to the presence of the public.
From
Runway excursion Accident Supermarine Spitfire PR Mk XIX F-AZJS, Sunday 11 June 2017
The Spitfire Flipped over while trying to take off. The pilot was slightly injured but taken to hospital. An 18-year-old woman on the public was injured on the shoulder by a projection (p...
aviation-safety.net
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- Thread starter
- #6
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
That's too bad. I don't really understand what they are talking about "too fast flight line." I would think the only way that you could do that would be to build up some speed and then hit the brakes. It is true that it was common practice with Spits to have some people hold down the tail with their weight when doing a run-up but I would think that once you are rolling it would not be a problem. In one case a woman failed to let go and went around the pattern while holding onto the tail, but made it down safely.
Maybe a translation thing, the crash reports are translated from French
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Probably means opening the throttle too quickly - tail comes up fast, props strike ground and the result as shown in the video.
Not helped by the pilot being on his first flight (it didnt actually become a flight) in a Spitfire and who......
The pilot stated that he had perhaps braked involuntarily during the takeoff roll, by using the rudder pedal at a time when he was increasing power. The aeroplane tilted forward onto its nose and then flipped over onto its back.
Runway excursion Accident Supermarine Spitfire PR Mk XIX F-AZJS, Sunday 11 June 2017
The Spitfire Flipped over while trying to take off. The pilot was slightly injured but taken to hospital. An 18-year-old woman on the public was injured on the shoulder by a projection (p...
aviation-safety.net
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
Spitfire wheel brakes are controlled by the lever on the control column grip, which looks very like a bicycle brake lever. A bias system applies brake pressure to the wheels, with a push on the rudder pedals distributing that pressure to the relevant wheel when taxing / turning on the ground; for example, squeeze the brake lever and push on the right rudder pedal to swing to starboard.
The pilot would have had to be squeezing the brake lever to apply the brakes, probably unlikely during a take-off roll.
It certainly looks like the throttle was opened too quickly, causing the prop strike which lead to the nose digging in.
The pilot would have had to be squeezing the brake lever to apply the brakes, probably unlikely during a take-off roll.
It certainly looks like the throttle was opened too quickly, causing the prop strike which lead to the nose digging in.
Crimea_River
Marshal
"Too fast flight line" might mean that there were many aircraft in the circuit with short fly-by intervals and so the pilot may have been rushed to beat it out of there.
Interesting side note: I met Terry and Karl at Duxford a month after that incident and one of my other motives was to swing by the ARC (Aircraft Restoration Company) and pick up some small items from them for our Hurricane restoration back home. Communications with ARC leading up to my trip were becoming difficult to the extent that we were concerned that the relationship was souring and they were ignoring us. When I met up with my ARC rep, James, at Duxford, he was most gracious and took the time to take me and my family on a tour of the shop at which point he revealed that they were extremely busy trying to move things through and make room for a Spitfire wing that was coming to the shop. Seems there was this accident in France (see above) and the owner was anxious to get the plane back in the air asap. That Spitfire wing had only just been rebuilt by ARC prior to this accident and now it was coming back! Think of the money involved......
Interesting side note: I met Terry and Karl at Duxford a month after that incident and one of my other motives was to swing by the ARC (Aircraft Restoration Company) and pick up some small items from them for our Hurricane restoration back home. Communications with ARC leading up to my trip were becoming difficult to the extent that we were concerned that the relationship was souring and they were ignoring us. When I met up with my ARC rep, James, at Duxford, he was most gracious and took the time to take me and my family on a tour of the shop at which point he revealed that they were extremely busy trying to move things through and make room for a Spitfire wing that was coming to the shop. Seems there was this accident in France (see above) and the owner was anxious to get the plane back in the air asap. That Spitfire wing had only just been rebuilt by ARC prior to this accident and now it was coming back! Think of the money involved......
- Thread starter
- #12
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
Well, if you look at the video it does not appear that he opened the throttle very fast and the airplane nosed right over, which would have occurred without much movement. I read recently of a nice Cub wrecked when a pilot not familiar with it propped it with the chocks in place, but had the throttle too far advanced and it went right onto its nose. Instead the Spit starts to move, rolls a bit and then noses over. Looked like hitting the brakes to me. I would think that once he had the tail up the elevator would provide enough control authority to keep it from nosing over if the pilot knew what he was doing.
Airframes
Benevolens Magister
As previously described, the brakes can not be applied without squeezing the break handle on the control column grip, which is a deliberate and definite action.
However, if slight forward pressure on the control column, combined with throttle opening happened, then the result is inevitable - tail up, nose down, prop strike, end of take off roll.
I would also add that, if this was the pilot's first Spitfire flight, then being in a Griffon engined Mk. 19 is akin to putting an experienced car diver, but lacking high- performance car experience, into an F.1 car, and asking him / her to meet the lap record at Monaco.
Pilots with the BBMF start out, after tail-dragger training on Chipmunk at minimum, with their first airshow season on the Hurricane, They then move on the the "baby fighters", the Spitfire Mk.II and Mk..V, before eventually progressing to the PR.19, via the Mk.IX / Mk.XVI , a process which takes three to four years, depending on the individual's posting to the Flight and other RAF commitments.
Think about this from the perspective of a pilot used to flying a Cessna 172 or a Cherokee 180, then told to fly a Harvard, or even a ( perhaps ) more forgiving Stearman for the first time, on a less then "smooth" grass runway.
However, if slight forward pressure on the control column, combined with throttle opening happened, then the result is inevitable - tail up, nose down, prop strike, end of take off roll.
I would also add that, if this was the pilot's first Spitfire flight, then being in a Griffon engined Mk. 19 is akin to putting an experienced car diver, but lacking high- performance car experience, into an F.1 car, and asking him / her to meet the lap record at Monaco.
Pilots with the BBMF start out, after tail-dragger training on Chipmunk at minimum, with their first airshow season on the Hurricane, They then move on the the "baby fighters", the Spitfire Mk.II and Mk..V, before eventually progressing to the PR.19, via the Mk.IX / Mk.XVI , a process which takes three to four years, depending on the individual's posting to the Flight and other RAF commitments.
Think about this from the perspective of a pilot used to flying a Cessna 172 or a Cherokee 180, then told to fly a Harvard, or even a ( perhaps ) more forgiving Stearman for the first time, on a less then "smooth" grass runway.
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I was thinking about that lovely propeller, I doubt there was much left to repair and they dont come cheap at all.
I think its best not to phone that pilot when he is ironing the duvet.
- Thread starter
- #16
MIflyer
1st Lieutenant
Good news! Are they are going to give that pilot another crack at it?
They should let him practice on this one first:
They should let him practice on this one first:
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