Messerschmitt Bf 162 V2

[johnbr]

Specifications (Bf 162)
Data from Warplanes of the Third Reich[1]

General characteristics

• Crew: 3 - pilot, gunner, and bombardier/navigator
• Length: 12.75 m (41 ft 10 in)
• Wingspan: 17.16 m (56 ft 3½ in)
• Height: 3.58 m (11 ft 9 in)
• Loaded weight: 5,810 kg (12,782 lb)
• Powerplant: 2 × Daimler-Benz DB 600Aa liquid-cooled inverted V12 piston engines, 736 kW (986 hp) each

Performance

• Maximum speed: 480 km/h (259 knots, 298 mph) at 3,400 m (11,155 ft)
• Cruise speed: 425 km/h (230 knots, 264 mph) at 3,400 m (11,155 ft)
• Range: 782 km (423 nmi, 486 mi)
• Rate of climb: 9.0 m/s (1,770 ft/min)

Armament

• Guns: 1× 7.92 mm MG 15 machine gun in dorsal position
• Bombs: 10× 50 kg (110 lb) bombs internally and 2× 250 kg (550 lb) bombs externally (overloa

 

[johnbr]

 

[johnbr]

 

[Old Wizard]

 

[Wurger]

 

[Gnomey]

Good shots!

 

[Capt. Vick]

Never seen those shots before! Great stuff!

 

[chuter]

Sometime after the cancellation of this program the RLM secretly re-issued the 162 number to Heinkel for their jet fighter to throw of foreign intelligence much like the XP-59A was not at all related to the XP-59. Got to keep those spies honest.

 

[GrauGeist]

Sometime after the cancellation of this program the RLM secretly re-issued the 162 number to Heinkel for their jet fighter to throw of foreign intelligence much like the XP-59A was not at all related to the XP-59. Got to keep those spies honest.

It wasn't secretly re-issued, the designation 8-162 was 6 years old between the decommissioning of the Bf162 program and the inception of the He162 program.

And there was no secrecy in the XP-59 designation...Bell's XP-52 project rolled over to the XP-59 project, which was a twin-boom jet fighter concept. When that project failed to deliver, the XP-59 was carried over to the XP-59A (note the "A" there?) Airacomet project. All of which, was directly related...

 

[chuter]

It wasn't secretly re-issued, the designation 8-162 was 6 years old between the decommissioning of the Bf162 program and the inception of the He162 program.

And there was no secrecy in the XP-59 designation...Bell's XP-52 project rolled over to the XP-59 project, which was a twin-boom jet fighter concept. When that project failed to deliver, the XP-59 was carried over to the XP-59A (note the "A" there?) Airacomet project. All of which, was directly related...

Directly related? The -42 and -59, yeah. But the 34 foot slightly inverted gull-wing with ~8 (?) degree wing sweep and tail boom attachments of the XP-59 doesn't seem to have anything (maybe airfoil?) in common with the 38 foot straight, tapered, constant dihedral wing of the XP-59A, and the two fuselages are from different planets. One reason for the P-59A's failure (or lack of unqualified success) was due to the fact that Bell wasn't allowed to make wind tunnel models for testing to maintain secrecy (XP-59 models had been made and photographed) so they had to be rather conservative in their design.

All the references I can find all mention the -59/-59A secrecy angle so if you've got something other than this I'd be interested in seeing it.

 

[GrauGeist]

Directly related? The -42 and -59, yeah. But the 34 foot slightly inverted gull-wing with ~8 (?) degree wing sweep and tail boom attachments of the XP-59 doesn't seem to have anything (maybe airfoil?) in common with the 38 foot straight, tapered, constant dihedral wing of the XP-59A, and the two fuselages are from different planets. One reason for the P-59A's failure (or lack of unqualified success) was due to the fact that Bell wasn't allowed to make wind tunnel models for testing to maintain secrecy (XP-59 models had been made and photographed) so they had to be rather conservative in their design.

All the references I can find all mention the -59/-59A secrecy angle so if you've got something other than this I'd be interested in seeing it.

Alright...fair enough...

Let's go back to your original statement:

Sometime after the cancellation of this program the RLM secretly re-issued the 162 number to Heinkel for their jet fighter to throw of foreign intelligence...

The fact of the matter is, the RLM re-used or re-issued designations quite often.
Here's a list:
8-11: Dornier Do11 bomber - Wiener Neustädter Flugzeugwerke WNF11 amphibious transport
8-15: Dornier Do15 bomber - Wiener Neustädter Flugzeugwerke WNF15 light (touring) aircraft
8-16: Dornier Do16 flying boat - Wiener Neustädter Flugzeugwerke WNF16 trainer
8-26: Dornier Do26 flying boat - Klemm Kl26 sports aircraft
8-42: Focke-Wulf Fw42 bomber - Heinkel He42 seaplane
8-47: Focke-Wulf Fw47 weather recon - Heinkel He47 light bomber
8-49: Heinkel He49 fighter - Junker Ju49 Hi-Alt reasearch
8-55: Focke-Wulf Fw55 sports aircraft - Nagler-Rolz Nr55 helicopter
8-58: Focke-Wulf Fw58 transport/trainer - Heinkel He58 seaplane
8-60: Heinkel He60 seaplane - Junkers Ju60 passenger aircraft
8-61: Focke-Wulf Fw61 helicopter - Heinkel He61 recon
8-62: Focke-Wulf Fw62 seaplane - Heinkel He62 seaplane
8-64: Arado Ar64 fighter - Heinkel He64 sports aircraft
8-65: Arado Ar65 (re-engined Ar64) - Heinkel He65 mailplane
8-66: Arado Ar66 trainer/night intruder - Heinkel He66 divebomber
8-103: Albatros Al103 experimental - Feisler Fl103 V1 flying bomb (and Fl103R piloted)
8-136: Blohm & Voss Bv136 trainer - Hütter Hü136 divebomber
8-147: Gotha Go147 STOL recon - Junkers Ju147 bomber
8-152: Focke-Wulf Ta152 fighter - Klemm Kl152 fighter
8-162: Messerschmitt Bf162 bomber - Heinkel He162 jet fighter
8-163: Messerschmitt Bf163 STOL recon - Messerschmitt Me163 rocket interceptor
8-166: Feisler Fi166 jet fighter - Kiel FK166 trainer
8-186: Focke-Wulf Fw186 autogyro - Junkers Ju186 Hi-Alt research
8-187: Focke-Wulf Fw187 fighter - Junkers Ju187 divebomber
8-209: Messerschmitt Me209 speed record aircraft - Messerschmitt Me209 fighter
8-225: AGO Ag225 fighter - Focke-Achgelis Fa225 autogyro
8-266: Blohm & Voss Bv226 glide bomb (renamed BV246) - Horton Ho226 jet fighter (flying wing)
8-283: Focke-Achgelis Fa283 jet/autogyro - Focke-Wulf Fw283 ramjet fighter
8-296: Arado Ar296 trainer - Henschel Hs296 rocket-assist glide bomb
8-430: Arado Ar430 amphibious transport - Gotha Ka430 transport glider

And so we see, that after all these dual applications, the 8-162 doesn't seem so "secret" and unusual after all, does it?

Perhaps my comment was misleading about the XP-59's secrecy. Yes, the XP-59 to "A" was intentional, even going so far as to have a fake propeller mounted on the nose when it was being transported to the test-site.

Regarding the XP-59 continuity from the conventional type to the jet, they tried to use several features from the XP-59 on the XP-59A, such as the inlet duct in the nose (think He178) but the high volume of the engines' airflow prevented this feature.

Regarding your comment about no wind tunnel testing...not sure where you picked that up at, as it was most certainly tested in a wind tunnel - while not the full-sized testing as was done later in Virginia, but the 5-foot tunnel at Wright Field was used with a scale mockup during development. It may not have provided the most accurate data, but it was done. While the lack of full-sized windtunnel testing may have had a hand with the P-59's poor performance, the fact that it was rushed through from paper to prototype and the difficulties that GE was experiencing in trying to built their version of the W.2B with the incomplete data they were provided with.

 

[johnbr]

 

[Gnomey]

Cool shot!

 

[johnbr]