MG 151/20 shell colors

Discussion in 'Weapons Systems Tech.' started by MeyerBMW, Nov 14, 2006.

  1. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    Hi. I am new here. I am trying to find refference material on what colors the Germans painted their MG 151/20 shells. I have a couple of them I would like to restore. I cannot find any material on the bullets themselves. Any help is welcome.
    The shells are an AP, HE, and HEI.
    There is some color on these but not sure about the striping and overall color. Thanks, Scott.
     
  2. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    I cannot remember the AP round but it was more pointed ~ hard tip solid colour so black to grey I am assuming with any pics in front of me.

    blue body for Incendiary round
    yellow body for Minen or HE round, but with some differences
    yellow body with green ring at the top - HE round with self destroying fuse
    yellow body with blue ring at the top - HE round with Incendiary
     
  3. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    I took some pics The shinny tip is the HEI the pointed one is AP and the other one is the HE round. Now the colors are different but thats what I was told. OK I cannoy get the photo. The AP round has black with a light blue stripe towards the top. The HEI round is all blue. Dark blue. The HE round is mostly missing its paint but has a green stripe at the top just below the fuse. If you would let me I can email you the pic I have. Maybe it will help. Thanks, Scott
     
  4. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    WHOOPS. You answered my question. I should read thing better befor I respond :)
     
  5. lesofprimus

    lesofprimus Active Member

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    Heres a pic...
     

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  6. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    yes that is a 3cm Minengeschoss HE with self destroying fuze. I have two of the same yellow body with green ring at the top/base of the fuze. the body has a capital black M for Minen. The fuze states ZZ 1505 A which is a nasty exploder, efc 44.

    here is a pic of HE rounds and AP mix
     

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  7. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    to add to my text I want to make it clear that I have several 20mm's not 30mm's as Les has shown. my pic is 20mm on link with brasss casings the rounds are actually just applied to the cases as the rounds would be snug fit up to the swell mark.

    here is a pic of armor destroying 20mm hard point that I was referring to earlier used by Ju 87D's
     

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  8. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    Where did you get the JU 87 shells? Where would I look to find these (MG 151/20) shells for sale? I have used EBay but don't know of any other resources.
     
  9. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    OK, I found the description of the one I thought was the HEI.
    A 2 cm Brandgranate L'spur m. Zerl. (IT with self destruct). Comes with correct AZ 1528 fuze and not the AZ 1504 as sometimes can be seen on these shells. Fuze stamped "AZ1528A wc 227/44" Shell stamped "eee 6 45 (Luftwaffe eagle)" Case headstamp "auj 90 44 (Eagle)". Case with electric primer.
    I know what the I stands for but what does the T stand for?
     
  10. Dolpho

    Dolpho Member

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    This are my only color pictures
     

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  11. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    Meyer the scans were sent to me from an ammo expert some 5 years ago. the fuze 1504 was common with HE I, the fuze you present I have never heard of before but is late war. what colour is the body of the round ? yellow with green and a red band or ?

    dolpho your top pic is interesting as the bands sometimes were reversed shows an HEI with a filler of Pentrhite was - 36 and incendiary - 34 and an Aluminum plated A.Z. 1504 fuze.

    bottom scan shows HE/T with Penthrite wax - 57.1 and an A.Z. 1504 fuze Aluminum

    T = Tracer
     
  12. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    I will try a pic. The shinny tip one is the IT round.[​IMG]
     
  13. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    Interesting ! those rounds have seen a better day haven't they ?

    cases are brass or hardened steel. 2 of the Minen rounds that I own - 2cm, are hard to tell but I have several from a heavy Sturm Fw of 5.Sturm/JG 4 on September 11, 44 when it was shot down and the rounds blew off during the ensuing explosion. the rounds of course are gone but the cases are twisted steel with the only marking at the base as 44 as readable
     
  14. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    All the stamping on them is in great shape. I want to strip them down and recolor them. It should turn out pretty good.
     
  15. Tony Williams

    Tony Williams Member

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    I have a book on German aircraft ammo of WW2 which shows no fewer than 31 variations in 20mm shell shape and colouring...

    Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website and discussion forum
     
  16. MeyerBMW

    MeyerBMW New Member

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    What is the name of the book? Thanks Scott.
     
  17. Tony Williams

    Tony Williams Member

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    "Deutsche Bordwaffen Munition bis 1945", by J. Lippert. It was privately published in small numbers in Munich some years ago, and the projectiles appear to be hand-coloured.

    Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website and discussion forum
     
  18. stardude89

    stardude89 New Member

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    hi i have recently come into these 20mm shells and was unable to identify their type from the markings, would some1 please help?


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  19. stardude89

    stardude89 New Member

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    i have been told this 20mm round is an 'armour peircing incendiary' can anybody confirm that?

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
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    hmmmmmmmm

    a couple of questions:

    what is the colour band on the yellow body ?

    what is the colour of the lower band on the blue bodied round ?

    upper yellow would indicate High explosive, the blue would indicate AP round but the fuze cap does not look right to me. Maroon red band = Incendiary
    tracer

    can you read the markings on the silver coloured fuze caps for us ?

    your second pic looks like a yellow band on the AP round making it HE not Incendiary

    E ~
     
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