Planes of Fame Airshow 2014 Horsemen

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by GregP, Nov 30, 2015.

  1. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    Here is our 2014 airshow featuring the Horsemen. They did two acts: one with P-51s and one with F-86s.

    This isn't the whole show .... just the Horsemen ... Steve Hinton, Dan Friedken, and Ed Shipley in no particular order. I think Dan was flying lead (F-86), Steve was left wing, and Ed was right wing, based on aircraft markings. But ... they COULD have swapped seats ... who knows? Only the Horsemen!


    View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3dSq-IXrx8

    Thought it might be interesting ...
     
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  2. Old Wizard

    Old Wizard Well-Known Member

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  3. Token

    Token Active Member

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    For those of you that have not been there, the airshow at Chino is one of the best I have ever been to that is not military sponsored or on a military base. The energy is excellent, and the variety of aircraft seen in flight is exceptional.

    T!
     
  4. Gnomey

    Gnomey World Travelling Doctor
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    Excellent video!
     
  5. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #5 GregP, Dec 2, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2015
    Here is an OLD video from the 1960s back when we were just "The Air Museum." If you watch, you'll see our Nakajima Ki-84 in there. It is now in a museum in Japan. When we flew it, we had to stay in the 250 - 320 mph range because one prop blade was very slightly bent and couldn't be straightened. When the present owners bought it, they cut the wings off with chain saws for transport! Bet that wouldn't happen today.


    View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8waXqQoBri4

    The Ki-84 got sold because that was rather soon after WWII and there was ZERO interest from the public in Japanese aircraft from the war. We couldn't even get gas money for an appearance!

    You don't see people wearing suits riding on the wing of a radial-powered plane today as it taxis in. The oil stains are hard to get off ...
     
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  6. Old Wizard

    Old Wizard Well-Known Member

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  7. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    Here are some P-51s formating on our B-25.

     
  8. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    Could you let me know the Japanese owner's name if possible, Greg?
    According to our local wiki, he was a patriotic IJN fighter pilot during the war.
    I am curious.
     
  9. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    I can ask ... but the owner is the museum where it currently resides. I believe they repaired the damage to the wing spars and wings, and have no real idea of the actual owner's name.

    I believe it is the peace Museum for Kamakaze, Kyushu, Japan. I'll ask Ed Maloney if he remembers this weekend (assuming he is there). At least we have video of it flying!
     
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  10. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Greg for your cooperation.

    According to my brief research relating to Fuji Heavy Industries (former Nakajima Aircraft) which was in charge of maintenance of the said Ki-84 airframe in the 1970s, neither wing nor spar was cut.
    It was overhauled properly based on manual to deliver to the local museum. There seems a myth.
     
  11. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    The myth came from watching the cutting happen. I know people who were there. They were appalled, but didn't say anything at the time since the people doing the cutting were the owners. Our information on it says the spar was subsequently repaired for static display, but will never be cleared for flight. To fly it, a new spar would be required.

    That is easy for me to believe, at least the new spar part. We have a Mitsubishi J2M-3 that has never been badly damaged and it would probably require a new spar for flight, too.

    Since the Ki-84 is metal, there is almost nothing that could not be made airworthy should the desire to fly it be there. I'm not sure, but I have heard it is a museum in the city and nowhere near an airport. So they will likely never attempt flight, nor perhaps even move it more than a few feet, unless and until it is sold or given to someone else. Being a part of Japanese history, I'd say that is unlikely in the foreseeable future.

    Buy, hey ... start a grass roots movement to restore it to flight status and you never know.
     
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  12. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    Interesting story, Greg.
    Are they going to restore what does not necessarily need restoration as being thought still airworthy except the engine?

    1. Fuji's staff clearly says that Fuji's engineers separated the fuselage into two (front and rear) to make delivery easy from Utsunomiya (Fuji) to Kyoto (1st museum) circa 1980 and, later, Wakayama (2nd museum) to Chiran(3rd museum) finally but some amateur enthusiasts may have thought they had cut the fuselage. There was no damage on the airframe at all, of course.

    2. An ANA (All Nippon Airway) engineer also testifies that he did not confirm any damage on the spar at all in Kyoto circa 1991 when they re-disassembled the airframe to deliver from Kyoto(1st museum) to Wakayama(2nd museum) but he found a serious crack on the engine case.

    If you may need and someone at your side can read Japanese well, I'm able to show you exact data sources.
    They state neither myth nor rumor but genuine testimonies as I mentioned above.
     
  13. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    Pictures don't lie, Shinpachi. I've seen the photos of the cut wings, or at least it sure LOOKS like the Ki-84 with cut wings. I haven't mis-identified one in many years as it is my personal favorite Japanese fighter of all times..

    But I have no dog in this hunt since it is a static plane anyway. At some point, if they want to ever fly it again, then everyone associated with it will find out. Up until then, maybe someone can get a look inside the wings at some point. Most museums are not fond of allowing that.
     
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  14. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    #14 Shinpachi, Dec 3, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2015
    I don't want to bother you, Greg, but will you show me the picture you have seen as I can wait for it no matter how long you may take?
    Wasn't it like this one?

    I am asking because I was 20 in 1973 when the airframe came back to Japan but now wonder how many enthusiasts understood how to transport it on the ground.
    Former Nakajima engineers were still active in Fuji Heavy Industries at the time and they led maintenance of the Ki-84.
    I trust them.

    Ki-115 Tsurugi.jpg
    Ki-115
     
  15. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #15 GregP, Dec 3, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2015
    Let me ask you something, and you think about it, Shinpachi.

    Here we have a guy, Ed Maloney, who has spent his entire life since early high school recovering classic airplanes. He started the Planes of Fame and recovered many of the now-famous planes around the world that used to be his at one time. Ed Maloney recovered two Boeing P-26s from Guatemala and the one in the National Air and Space Museum (serial 33-135) was put there by Ed Maloney. Ours flies and is serial 33-123. We have many airplanes that are the "only one left," and we fly some of those on a semi-regular basis. We even have a spare wing spar for the P-26! I know of nobody else who does. He recovered several Japanese planes and restored some. In fact, our Zero is in the late stages of a major overhaul right now. He recovered the P-63 that was eventually sold to Mike Carol, our Seversky AT-12, the Northrop N9M-B, the only flying Dauntless (the rest are converted A-24s), has one of two flying razorback P-47s, DID have a Mitsubishi Betty (just sold to Paul Allen). That's a few and there are more.

    So ask yourself this question.

    Who is more likely to be mistaken here: Ed Maloney, the guy who recovered it, flew it, sold it, and clearly remembers the event? ... or the guys who bought it back in the 1980s, who have a vested interest in everyone believing it is complete and in perfect shape, and want you to pay money to come and see it?

    In the end, as long as it is static, it makes no difference, a good repair for static display is just fine and is cosmetically undetectable. I'll believe Ed is mistaken when someone tries to fly the Ki-84 and excuses keep popping up for why that is impractical. As I said earlier, I don't believe there are any plans to fly it, run it, or even move the propeller at this time.

    But I could be mistaken. And if there is ONE guy who consistently asks me not to post anything too unusual about the museum on the internet, it is Ed. Since he's the museum founder, he wants you to come see it at the museum, sort of like the guys (or gals) who currently own the Ki-84 want you to do, too.
     
  16. GregP

    GregP Well-Known Member

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    #16 GregP, Dec 5, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2015
    Possibly interesting ...




    Just like they started Bf 109s in WWII ... with an inertia starter.
     
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