GregP
Major
The Fw 190 started life with a BMW 139 radial, descended from the BMW 132. It was 55.4 liters, developed 1,550 HP, and suffered from rear row cooling inadequacy, and many other two or more row radials did.
The Fw 190 A/B/C/F sported a BMW 801 radial. The 801 introduced fuel injection, a compressor, and a "brain box" that controlled everything with a single lever. The dry weight was 2,667 pounds and developed 1,600 HP for takeoff with a continuous power rating of 1,280 HP. The "A" version ran clockwise; the "B" ran counterclockwise. Overall diameter was 51.5 inches. Fuel consumption at rated power (1,280 HP) was 55 gph. The engine was progressively improved to 1,700 HP for takeoff and then to 2,000 HP for takeoff. The "E" model went to 2,270 HP for takeoff with water / methanol injection, but that didn't last for very long after takeoff.
The Fw 190 D sported a Junkers Jumo 213, mostly the "E".
The Ta 152 sported the Jumo 213E and 222 as wella s the DB 603.
The Ta 152H sported a Jumo 213 E/F that weighed in, as specified above, at about 1,808 pounds dry. The Ta 152 C also had a Jumo (213A) of about the same weight except for the C-0 and C-1, which had a DB 603L powerplant (see above). Cone C models had a Jumo 222 wich made 2,465 HP for takeoff and 1,870 HP at cruise. It had a dry weight of 2,399 pounds.
The BMW 802 was a development of the 139 and achieved 2,400 HP on the test stand, but never was developed into a production engine before the end of hostilities. It never made it into a deployed Fw 190 / Ta 152.
The BMW 803 was totally new engine of 28 cylinder (4 rows of 7 cylinder, as was the American R-4360). Two different versions were built; one having normal valves and one having an experimental valve system. Both were running on test beds when the war ended and produced 3,900 HP for takeoff and 3,350 HP as a continuous rating. They were 83.5 liters (5,095 cubic inches compared with the American R-4360). Dry weight was 9,305 pounds.
The DB 603 was also a powerplant. It was an inverted V-12 of 44.5 liters, made 1,750 HP for takeoff and a dry weight of 2,006 pounds. Continuous rating was 1,450 HP. A slightly enlarged version was the DB 603E with a continuous rating of 1,560 HP and a dry weight of 2,050 pounds. The DB 603 L made 1,980 HP for takeoff and 1,400 HP continuous. The most powerful DB 603 was the N with a rating of 2,830 HP for takeoff and 1,930 HP continuous.
The Jumo 213E was a 12 cylinder, inverted Vee that appeared to late in the war to do much in the way of help, but was a good engine. It displaced 35.97 liters and developed 1,740 HP for takeoff and 1,200 HP continuous. Dry weight was 1,808 pounds. An improved version making 2,000 HP for takeoff was scheduled but never made production.
You will note the BMW 803 weighed in dry at 9,305 pounds, and the rest of the engines flown in the Fw 190 / Ta 152 weighed in at less than one-quarter of this weight. If there is anyone out there who had ever designed an aircraft, you know you cannot stuff in an engine of twice the power and four times the weioght with no other design changes. If nothing else, the wing and tail surfaces will not handle the torque and extra weight, and the CG will be unflyable.
I submit the alluded-to Fw 190 / Ta 152 with the BMW 803 would have been an entirely new and larger aircraft that never even made the drawing board, much less had metal cut for it. I would view any suggestion of flying a standard Fw 190 or Ta 152 with a BMW 803 as being unrealistic to say the least, but the potential for a heavy fighter was certainly there, as far as a powerplant goes, when the war ended. Things might have gotten interesting if this dreamed-of fighter had ever gotten into production. Of course, by then, other more advanced piston fighters were flying for other countries and most were rapidly being abandoned for jets. Some were even built and never flown!
I submit the Third Reich would have done the same and concentrated on jets, had it survived past early 1945.
Any comments on the potential future of big pistons in mid-to late 1945 had the war continued?
The Fw 190 A/B/C/F sported a BMW 801 radial. The 801 introduced fuel injection, a compressor, and a "brain box" that controlled everything with a single lever. The dry weight was 2,667 pounds and developed 1,600 HP for takeoff with a continuous power rating of 1,280 HP. The "A" version ran clockwise; the "B" ran counterclockwise. Overall diameter was 51.5 inches. Fuel consumption at rated power (1,280 HP) was 55 gph. The engine was progressively improved to 1,700 HP for takeoff and then to 2,000 HP for takeoff. The "E" model went to 2,270 HP for takeoff with water / methanol injection, but that didn't last for very long after takeoff.
The Fw 190 D sported a Junkers Jumo 213, mostly the "E".
The Ta 152 sported the Jumo 213E and 222 as wella s the DB 603.
The Ta 152H sported a Jumo 213 E/F that weighed in, as specified above, at about 1,808 pounds dry. The Ta 152 C also had a Jumo (213A) of about the same weight except for the C-0 and C-1, which had a DB 603L powerplant (see above). Cone C models had a Jumo 222 wich made 2,465 HP for takeoff and 1,870 HP at cruise. It had a dry weight of 2,399 pounds.
The BMW 802 was a development of the 139 and achieved 2,400 HP on the test stand, but never was developed into a production engine before the end of hostilities. It never made it into a deployed Fw 190 / Ta 152.
The BMW 803 was totally new engine of 28 cylinder (4 rows of 7 cylinder, as was the American R-4360). Two different versions were built; one having normal valves and one having an experimental valve system. Both were running on test beds when the war ended and produced 3,900 HP for takeoff and 3,350 HP as a continuous rating. They were 83.5 liters (5,095 cubic inches compared with the American R-4360). Dry weight was 9,305 pounds.
The DB 603 was also a powerplant. It was an inverted V-12 of 44.5 liters, made 1,750 HP for takeoff and a dry weight of 2,006 pounds. Continuous rating was 1,450 HP. A slightly enlarged version was the DB 603E with a continuous rating of 1,560 HP and a dry weight of 2,050 pounds. The DB 603 L made 1,980 HP for takeoff and 1,400 HP continuous. The most powerful DB 603 was the N with a rating of 2,830 HP for takeoff and 1,930 HP continuous.
The Jumo 213E was a 12 cylinder, inverted Vee that appeared to late in the war to do much in the way of help, but was a good engine. It displaced 35.97 liters and developed 1,740 HP for takeoff and 1,200 HP continuous. Dry weight was 1,808 pounds. An improved version making 2,000 HP for takeoff was scheduled but never made production.
You will note the BMW 803 weighed in dry at 9,305 pounds, and the rest of the engines flown in the Fw 190 / Ta 152 weighed in at less than one-quarter of this weight. If there is anyone out there who had ever designed an aircraft, you know you cannot stuff in an engine of twice the power and four times the weioght with no other design changes. If nothing else, the wing and tail surfaces will not handle the torque and extra weight, and the CG will be unflyable.
I submit the alluded-to Fw 190 / Ta 152 with the BMW 803 would have been an entirely new and larger aircraft that never even made the drawing board, much less had metal cut for it. I would view any suggestion of flying a standard Fw 190 or Ta 152 with a BMW 803 as being unrealistic to say the least, but the potential for a heavy fighter was certainly there, as far as a powerplant goes, when the war ended. Things might have gotten interesting if this dreamed-of fighter had ever gotten into production. Of course, by then, other more advanced piston fighters were flying for other countries and most were rapidly being abandoned for jets. Some were even built and never flown!
I submit the Third Reich would have done the same and concentrated on jets, had it survived past early 1945.
Any comments on the potential future of big pistons in mid-to late 1945 had the war continued?
