Question for Shinpachi

Discussion in 'Aviation' started by mhuxt, May 24, 2014.

  1. mhuxt

    mhuxt Active Member

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    Hi Shinpachi,


    There's a question over here

    Mikuni Flight School, Tachikawa Airport, Japan

    about Mikuni Flight School, specifically:

    "Now I know that this is a really long shot but.............does anyone know:

    - of any published material, in print or on the net, which covers the history of this flying school in the period 1929-33
    - what aircraft the flying school operated in the period 1930-33
    - whether the flying school closed in 1933 when civilian flying ceased at Tachikawa Airport
    - if not, to where the flying school transferred and what was its history thereafter
    - whether there is a successor to the flying school in existence today

    With my thanks in both hope and anticipation!

    AA"​

    Would you have any suggestions re: where to look? Some Japanese boards maybe?

    Thanks.
     
  2. N4521U

    N4521U Well-Known Member

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    #2 N4521U, May 25, 2014
    Last edited: May 25, 2014
    Comment removed by choice........

    Interesting question.
    I flew in to Tachikawa in '62 on my way to Subic Bay, a brief detour.
     
  3. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    Mikuni Flight School was opened by Prince Yamashina Takehiko, under control of Civil Aviation Bureau of Ministry of Communications, in July 1925 until June 1938 when the Bureau adopted new training system and returned the place/facilities to the army. It was located in the west side of Tachikawa Airfield and the main training aircraft was Salmson 2 disposed by the army as Type Otsu Mod.1 Recon.

    Data source:
    JACAR Japan Center for Asian Historical Records [Reference Code]C08051436000
    Local site WEB?????????- ??????????(3) -????????????????????????
    Local site ????????????????34???????So-net???

    AHA-MA-004-014-003.jpg Mikuni_Flight_School_circa_1930.JPG org.bin.jpeg Tachikawa_AS.JPG
     
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  4. vikingBerserker

    vikingBerserker Well-Known Member

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    Awesome info, thanks Shinpachi!
     
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  5. tomo pauk

    tomo pauk Creator of Interesting Threads

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    #5 tomo pauk, May 25, 2014
    Last edited: May 25, 2014
    Great stuff.
    BTW, seems like Salmson biplane has the cooling fan to add some fresh air to the engine bits parts...

    edit: scratch that, seems like it's a radiator :)
     
  6. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    The display is replica. Here is original state of the fan.

    Salmson2A2.JPG
     
  7. mhuxt

    mhuxt Active Member

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    Many thanks Shinpachi!
     
  8. N4521U

    N4521U Well-Known Member

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    BTW, do you know when the British flyers went to Japan to train carrier pilots?
     
  9. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    You are welcome, sir :)


    Colonel William Francis Forbes-Sempill (1893-1965) and his 29 staff came and stayed in Japan to train IJN airmen with approx 100 British aircraft from September 1921 to March 1923.
     
  10. avion ancien

    avion ancien New Member

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    Shinpachi, thank you. I was the poster of the original questions on another forum. So I'm most grateful to you for the information and questions. But here are some more.....!

    I'm researching the career of a pilot who trained at the Mikuni Flight School between, I think, 1930 and 1933. In that research I'm come across an essay written by him, for his high school year book, in which he relates something of his flying training. Curiously, he relates flying off a beach at low tide. Was the former Tachikawa Airport near or even connected to a beach? If not, can you suggest from which beach he might have been flying? It would seem that there must have been some sort of hangarage nearby as he talks about his instructor, Mr Yasuoka, taxiing 'the Avro' to a stretch of drier, harder sand. I assume that the aeroplane was an Avro 504K because later in the same yearbook there's a photograph of the pilot manhandling Avro 504K J-BHUB. Was this aeroplane part of the training fleet of the Mikuni Flight School? And finally, in the essay the pilot talks about 'the Avro' being less responsive than 'the Hanriot'. So did the Mikuni Flight School also have Hanriots as part of its training fleet and, if so, which models? Looking at the first of the photographs posted by you, Shinpachi, there appear to be three distinct aeroplane types parked in front of the hangar and those in the second row from the front have something of the appearance of Avro 504Ks.

    So here's my further thanks in anticipation...........
     
  11. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    :) no words but thanks.
     
  12. Maximowitz

    Maximowitz Active Member

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    Very impressive research.
     
  13. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    #13 Shinpachi, May 27, 2014
    Last edited: May 27, 2014
    Thanks, Paul. I am glad to see you again :)

    Old data are scattered or faded away together with elderly people.
    Not easy job to research.

    I wondered why the questioner did not check the Google map and the history of IJN flight school at least.
    Tachikawa Airfield located inland but Kasumigaura flight school faced a large beach.
    I lost words :)
     
  14. avion ancien

    avion ancien New Member

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    Please forgive me. I have very little knowledge of Japanese aviation and its history. The research that I'm undertaking relates primarily to matters and events outside of Japan. It's just that the pilot learnt to fly in Japan.

    That's a fair point and the simple answer is that it did not occur to me!

    For the reason given at the outset and the fact that the IJN Flight School was not hitherto mentioned, I hadn't the knowledge to do so. However I will do so now.

    Thank you for that information.

    Even if it may seem otherwise, I am grateful to you for allowing me to benefit from your knowledge, Shinpachi, and if it appears that I'm expecting others to do my research for me, that is not the impression I sought to give and it is not what I expect. It's just that it's not easy seeking such arcane information from the other side of the world when my resources are limited to what is available on the internet and, regrettably, I cannot read Japanese.
     
  15. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    What I can do is not much because there are not so many records about the private flight schools before ww2 as expected but main airframes used as trainers around 1930 are confirmed Avro 504, Nieuport 24 and Anrio 28 beside Salmson 2.

    For more information, JAPAN AERONAUTIC ASSOCIATION may know.

    Photo from JAPAN AERONAUTIC ASSOCIATION

    AHA-MA-004-014-003.jpg
     
  16. avion ancien

    avion ancien New Member

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    Thank you, Shinpachi. You've kindly provided me with another avenue to pursue.
     
  17. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    You are welcome, avion ancien :)
     
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  18. nuuumannn

    nuuumannn Well-Known Member

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    Hi Shinpachi and avion ancien, I hope I'm not being too presumptuous in presenting this information, but taking a look at the photo, I think you might be right in the types listed, Shinpachi. From the bottom, the two larger biplanes flanking the smaller one are Salmson 2A2s, the smaller one being a Nakajima Army Type Ko 3 Fighter/trainer, based on the Nieuport 28. The second row are Avro 504s, the square tailplanes are a giveaway and the smaller aircraft at front isn't easily identifiable, but not a Hanriot as it had squarish tailplane similar to the Nieuport. It looks like a single seat single bay biplane with no sweep on its main wing. Will have to look into it more.

    This is a fascinating topic and has recently been tainted with accusations of the main British players with treason, as in this thread here:

    http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/ww2-general/kriegsmarine-aircraft-carrier-39724-3.html#post1094763

    Following the post with the 'documentary', needless to say, my thoughts on its accuracy are not complimentary.

    A brilliant resource in English about early Japanese aviation is Japanese Aircraft 1910 - 1941 by Robert Mikesh and Shorzoe Abe. A comprehensive detailing of Japanese aircraft and activities, published by Putnam. Now out of print, but some around the 2nd hand market.

    http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Aircraft-1910-1941-Putnam-Aviation/dp/1557505632

    Good luck with your research, avion. Shinpachi, my interest in such things is the British Mission to Japan, in particular the Japanese use of the Cuckoo torpedoplane. Japan was the only export customer of the type and it was being prepared for a raid against the German High Seas Fleet in WW1 - sorry, don't mean to derail the thread, just to illustrate my interest in Japanese aviation.

    In case you are interested, I put this on the forum a few years back:

    http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/world-war-i/laying-eggs-someone-elses-basket-30776.html
     
  19. N4521U

    N4521U Well-Known Member

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    #19 N4521U, May 28, 2014
    Last edited: May 28, 2014
    Japanese Aircraft 1910 - 1941
    30 bucks used on Amazon
    $127.00, he's dreamin, on eBay
     
  20. Shinpachi

    Shinpachi Well-Known Member

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    It is interesting that Sempill is regarded as a traitor when he did not imagine that his country and Japan would go into the war. Japan also had no war intention with the western countries until the end of 1940 when the embargo looked endless. I think he only did his job faithfully.

    For his honour,
    Shinpachi

    Image: His letter to IJN date 23rd May, 1923

    0448_01S.JPG
     
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