REBUILDING A HAWKER TYPHOON TO FLYING STATUS

[fubar57]

A B.C. group is painstakingly rebuilding a WWII aircraft so it can take to the skies again | CBC News

A group on Vancouver Island that is painstakingly rebuilding a rare Typhoon fighter-bomber recently acquired a key component that they hope will help the Second World War-era aircraft take flight.

www.cbc.ca

 

[GrauGeist]

Dang, I'd love to see a Tiffy up close but they're about as rare as hen's teeth!

 

[rochie]

good to see another build under way.

Hawker Typhoon RB396 – Resurrecting a Forgotten Legend

HTPG is a registered charity in the UK that is raising funds to restore a Hawker Typhoon, RB396, to airworthiness. Become part of something special.

hawkertyphoon.com

this one over here !

 

[Glider]

I hate saying it bu even if you could restore it to flying condition, good luck trying to get anyone to insure it. The problem of course being the engine.

 

[Deleted member 68059]

I hate saying it bu even if you could restore it to flying condition, good luck trying to get anyone to insure it. The problem of course being the engine.

Many German engines like the 605 often had a life of 50 hours, which is substantially worse even than the Sabre, and
I`ve never heard of a grounded 109 because of insurance worries. Absolutely any warbird engine improperly serviced or built is
a potential death-trap. The problem will be restoring the engine properly, I dont think the paperwork will be what stops it,
should it fail in the attempt.

The pen pushers who spoil air shows will win one day, but they`ll just ban everything!

 

[Glider]

Many German engines like the 605 often had a life of 50 hours, which is substantially worse even than the Sabre, and
I`ve never heard of a grounded 109 because of insurance worries. Absolutely any warbird engine improperly serviced or built is
a potential death-trap. The problem will be restoring the engine properly, I dont think the paperwork will be what stops it,
should it fail in the attempt.

The pen pushers who spoil air shows will win one day, but they`ll just ban everything!

You are in many ways right, but that point is that there are many Merlin and Alison engines operating. To the best of my knowledge there are no Sabre engines running even in the test environments. The engine was a dog from the start, yes it improved, but only improved not properly fixed.
There are no spares and no one with an experience in these engines. Everything on the engine will need to be reverse engineered.

I do hope that I am wrong, but I fear that I am not.

Its a bit like the Whirlwind restoration project, they know that the engines are an issue they cannot overcome and ae happy to settle for a static display

 

[Deleted member 68059]

You are in many ways right, but that point is that there are many Merlin and Alison engines operating. To the best of my knowledge there are no Sabre engines running even in the test environments. The engine was a dog from the start, yes it improved, but only improved not properly fixed.
There are no spares and no one with an experience in these engines. Everything on the engine will need to be reverse engineered.

I do hope that I am wrong, but I fear that I am not.

Its a bit like the Whirlwind restoration project, they know that the engines are an issue they cannot overcome and ae happy to settle for a static display

Luckily there are engineering drawings preserved, although I dont think its a full engine set. So they can if necessary remake most of the major
parts properly (albeit ££££)

 

[cvairwerks]

Been watching Ian for a while now. Hope he can make lots more progress soon.

 

[special ed]

A great many years ago, I read of the first Jumo engine, from a flying 109D restoration, being sent to somewhere in Minnesota for overhaul. The article said the engine used babbit bearings, I can't remember now if rods and/or mains. The time was taken to machine & install real bearings. It was said the 25 hour service life was most likely in the originally installed bearings.

 

[Deleted member 68059]

Been watching Ian for a while now. Hope he can make lots more progress soon.

Super nice guy.

 

[pbehn]

More than anything I would like to hear it!

 

[Gnomey]

Very cool!

 

[fannum]

As an Air Force brat in post war Europe, and later helping Aussies, Swedes and Brits transition to the USN aircraft we shared with them, I managed to spend time with many WWII Typhoon/Tempest pilots. I hung on every word of their tales.
My collective impression was they were in awe of the Tiffie's capability, on constant guard for the next unexpected failure, leaving them with mixed feelings of pride and good riddance.
The Smithsonian Aviation Collection (pre-NASM) had one of the last Typhoons which had been brought over for flight test evaluation and saved by Paul Garber in the big Orchard Park plant Korean War disposal frenzy. When the Brits realized that they had foolishly scrapped them all, they diplomatically pressured the Smithsonian, and it was exchanged for a Hurricane assembled from spares on hand.

 

[rochie]

As an Air Force brat in post war Europe, and later helping Aussies, Swedes and Brits transition to the USN aircraft we shared with them, I managed to spend time with many WWII Typhoon/Tempest pilots. I hung on every word of their tales.
My collective impression was they were in awe of the Tiffie's capability, on constant guard for the next unexpected failure, leaving them with mixed feelings of pride and good riddance.
The Smithsonian Aviation Collection (pre-NASM) had one of the last Typhoons which had been brought over for flight test evaluation and saved by Paul Garber in the big Orchard Park plant Korean War disposal frenzy. When the Brits realized that they had foolishly scrapped them all, they diplomatically pressured the Smithsonian, and it was exchanged for a Hurricane assembled from spares on hand.

And here it is, pics taken on wednesday

 

[WAFU]

The Typhoon has an unenviable 'claim to fame'
It was the only RAF fighter considered so dangerous to its pilots, it was immediately grounded on VE Day.

It had 'interesting' habits.
Its controls were good once it got going, but it was slow to respond at low speed, less than ideal when landing the thing with its very variable stall speed - and habit of dropping a wing sharply near the stall.
The engines were never sorted. They could and did often blew up or seize solid just because they could - a less than ideal habit for a plane operating at low level. Ditching one in the sea with that huge chin radiator was suicidal. And bits had an nerving habit of just dropping off.

It was what it was, too much fighter designed beyond the limits of the technology of the day. Curiously, its progenitor, the Hawker Tornado, was cancelled by the demise of the RR Vulture engine due to its unreliability problems. But the Vulture was actually a significantly more reliable engine than the Sabre that 'replaced' it. A few Tornados would be fitted with a Centaurus radial which proved such a great success, it spurred the development of the Tempest. The Typhoon was yet another British design crippled by the utterly perverse Air Ministry fixation with weird configuration liquid cooled engines and a stern resistance to using radial engines

Nearly all Typhoons were 'destroyed in place' very quickly after VE Day.

So close, and yet so far, Britain's 'FW190

 

[Deleted member 68059]

The Typhoon has an unenviable 'claim to fame'
It was the only RAF fighter considered so dangerous to its pilots, it was immediately grounded on VE Day.

It had 'interesting' habits.
Its controls were good once it got going, but it was slow to respond at low speed, less than ideal when landing the thing with its very variable stall speed - and habit of dropping a wing sharply near the stall.
The engines were never sorted. They could and did often blew up or seize solid just because they could - a less than ideal habit for a plane operating at low level. Ditching one in the sea with that huge chin radiator was suicidal. And bits had an nerving habit of just dropping off.

It was what it was, too much fighter designed beyond the limits of the technology of the day. Curiously, its progenitor, the Hawker Tornado, was cancelled by the demise of the RR Vulture engine due to its unreliability problems. But the Vulture was actually a significantly more reliable engine than the Sabre that 'replaced' it. A few Tornados would be fitted with a Centaurus radial which proved such a great success, it spurred the development of the Tempest. The Typhoon was yet another British design crippled by the utterly perverse Air Ministry fixation with weird configuration liquid cooled engines and a stern resistance to using radial engines

Nearly all Typhoons were 'destroyed in place' very quickly after VE Day.


View attachment 713310

So close, and yet so far, Britain's 'FW190

The failure of Britain to field significant numbers of air cooled radial fighters in the war was not due to any "perverse" resistance to them (although some didnt think they were capable of high speeds until the 190 arrived) it was the fact the Centaurus was not ready, and the development of it dragged on for years. It wasnt any more ready than the Vulture.

If it had been ready when it was supposed to have been its entirely possible a Hawker Typhoon/Centaurus fighter would have emerged much sooner, but the realities of production meant that very little would have happened before 1944 anyway.

 

[WARSPITER]

As far as looks go the Typhoon is one of those rare beasts that looks really good but at the same time
looks like it wants to pound the living c**p out of someone.

 

[z42]

As far as looks go the Typhoon is one of those rare beasts that looks really good but at the same time
looks like it wants to pound the living c**p out of someone.

It certainly looks like a very powerful machine, if for no other reason than it being capable of pushing that massive radiator scoop through the air at more than a brisk walking pace.

 

[WAFU]

The failure of Britain to field significant numbers of air cooled radial fighters in the war was not due to any "perverse" resistance to them (although some didnt think they were capable of high speeds until the 190 arrived) it was the fact the Centaurus was not ready, and the development of it dragged on for years. It wasnt any more ready than the Vulture.

If it had been ready when it was supposed to have been its entirely possible a Hawker Typhoon/Centaurus fighter would have emerged much sooner, but the realities of production meant that very little would have happened before 1944 anyway.

View attachment 713453

British thinking was hijacked by the success of inline engines in the Schnieder Trophy races - it simply never occurred to the dunderheads at the Air Ministry that radials would and could simply overcome drag by becoming much more powerful than contemporary 'streamlined' inline engines. So all fighters were to be inline because a law.
And lets not forget Air Marshal Freeman, RAF head of procurement - a smart man, but fixated on inline engines and utterly hated the very idea of a radial engined fighter.
For an example of where this bone headed policy went, see the various attempts to get an inline Griffon or Sabre into the Tempest over Hawkers good advice before eventually going with a radial after wasting so much time.

That the radial was the future was acutely obvious even in 1939 when the R-2800 was producing a sturdy 2,000hp. But rather than eating a spot of humble pie and buying a license, the Air Ministry would waste 5 years pfaffing about trying to reinvent that wheel with the overly complex Centaurus.

 

[Deleted member 68059]

British thinking was hijacked by the success of inline engines in the Schnieder Trophy races - it simply never occurred to the dunderheads at the Air Ministry that radials would and could simply overcome drag by becoming much more powerful than contemporary 'streamlined' inline engines. So all fighters were to be inline because a law.
And lets not forget Air Marshal Freeman, RAF head of procurement - a smart man, but fixated on inline engines and utterly hated the very idea of a radial engined fighter.
For an example of where this bone headed policy went, see the various attempts to get an inline Griffon or Sabre into the Tempest over Hawkers good advice before eventually going with a radial after wasting so much time.

That the radial was the future was acutely obvious even in 1939 when the R-2800 was producing a sturdy 2,000hp. But rather than eating a spot of humble pie and buying a license, the Air Ministry would waste 5 years pfaffing about trying to reinvent that wheel with the overly complex Centaurus.

But you just said the Centaurus Typhoon was quote:

"Centaurus radial which proved such a great success"

Then when provided with primary source evidence your post was wrong, your opinion is now:

waste 5 years pfaffing about trying to reinvent that wheel with the overly complex Centaurus