The B-3 Bomber

[syscom3]

Soon a contract will be let out for development. The contract is specifying $550 Million per copy. But of course history has shown that this will be far more than that. A couple billion per airframe is not out of the realms of possibilities.

B-3: The Inside Story of America's Next Bomber

 

[Capt. Vick]

No doubt...

 

[syscom3]

Will the B-3 mean its three billion per copy?

 

[GrauGeist]

It'll be interesting to see what they come up with. I still think the B-1 is a potent delivery platform and still wonder why it's faded to the back-burner.

I also find it interesting that all these companies of WWII heritage are still in the game: Pratt&Whitney, Northrup-Grumman, Boeing-Lockheed. Also interesting how Rockwell was such a rising star in the aerospace/military industry and it seemed to fade away after several successes. Last time I saw anything about Rockwell, it was on a jigsaw at the shop.

 

[vikingBerserker]

I believe Rockwell was sold to Boeing in the mid 90's

 

[gumbyk]

Soon a contract will be let out for development. The contract is specifying $550 Million per copy. But of course history has shown that this will be far more than that. A couple billion per airframe is not out of the realms of possibilities.

Of course it will. The contract is set at $550m in 2010 dollars. Assuming 3% annual inflation (not unrealistic) by 2025 the cost will be over $850m.

 

[syscom3]

Of course it will. The contract is set at $550m in 2010 dollars. Assuming 3% annual inflation (not unrealistic) by 2025 the cost will be over $850m.

I bet that figure was set low too.

 

[GrauGeist]

I believe Rockwell was sold to Boeing in the mid 90's

Sad to see that Rockwell faded away, though...they built the B-1 and the Space Shuttle (among other military and civil types) and they looked like they would lead the way into the 21st century with space related vehicles.

Also considering that Rockwell had the legacy of North American Aviation behind them, it's hard to imagine them going by the wayside.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Rockwell was a great company. I never worked there but knew many people who did. Rockwell did not do well in securing long term contracts beyond the work they had with the B-1 and space shuttle. IMO their demise lied with the people who ran the place. Like other manufacturers, some of Rockwell managers didn't have the business sense or the backgrounds to move into other aviation ventures. After the last B-1s were delivered, Rockwell tried to do aircraft mods and commercial maintenance, they failed miserably. Many people who run manufacturers have no interest or passion out side "the factory." I've worked at manufacturers almost half of my 36 years in aviation and there were only a small percentage of engineers and managers who held A&P or pilot's licenses. Few attended airshows or had an "after-hours" passion about aviation. Some of the people at the top did not have a connection to their customer, what they operated or what products they were looking for. All this just my 2 cents.

 

[Torch]

As Industry Awaits Bomber Contract, New Details Emerge

 

[Token]

When I see terms like "optionally manned" used in the description of a proposed bomber I can't help but ask myself how close we are to reactivating the early 1950's 1st Pilotless Bomber Squadron.

T!

 

[davparlr]

Back in the 90s, I think, Northrop offered an additional 20 B-2s at $500M a copy. It was obviously turned down.

 

[GregP]

I'll be interested to see what the damed thing costs.

I'll oppose it wholeheartedly if I'm alive mostly due to cost, but it won't do any good. Congress will buy anything include call girls if they get a big enough kickback. Then they get caught convicted, go to a commandiered country-club called a "prison", play golf and make wood furniture for 2 -3 hours a day that gets thrown away until their sentence is completed, and then go on a speaking circuit about it at $200,000 per speech.

And you wonder why we're in the situation we're in?

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Back in the 90s, I think, Northrop offered an additional 20 B-2s at $500M a copy. It was obviously turned down.

They did - IIRC there wasn't going to be as much "stealth" emphasis with the aircraft proposed, basically a replacement for the B-1 or B-52.

 

[Lucky13]

Rockwell was a great company. I never worked there but knew many people who did. Rockwell did not do well in securing long term contracts beyond the work they had with the B-1 and space shuttle. IMO their demise lied with the people who ran the place. Like other manufacturers, some of Rockwell managers didn't have the business sense or the backgrounds to move into other aviation ventures. After the last B-1s were delivered, Rockwell tried to do aircraft mods and commercial maintenance, they failed miserably. Many people who run manufacturers have no interest or passion out side "the factory." I've worked at manufacturers almost half of my 36 years in aviation and there were only a small percentage of engineers and managers who held A&P or pilot's licenses. Few attended airshows or had an "after-hours" passion about aviation. Some of the people at the top did not have a connection to their customer, what they operated or what products they were looking for. All this just my 2 cents.

To them, work was just another paycheck then I guess...
Sad to hear....always wondered what 'happened' to the B-1.

When I see terms like "optionally manned" used in the description of a proposed bomber I can't help but ask myself how close we are to reactivating the early 1950's 1st Pilotless Bomber Squadron.

T!

Maybe it'll soon be like reading those magazines of the 50's, what it'll be like living in 2000, I'm surprised that we don't have bases on the moon yet!

 

[FLYBOYJ]

always wondered what 'happened' to the B-1.

The B-1 is alive and well.

B-1B Lancer - United States Nuclear Forces

 

[gumbyk]

The B-1 is alive and well.

B-1B Lancer - United States Nuclear Forces

I guess this is what's driving the move to new aircraft:

The limiting factor for B-1�s service life is the wing lower surface. At 15,200 hours, based on continued low level usage, the wing�s lower skin will need replacement. Current usage rates, operational procedures, and mishap attrition will place the inventory below the requirement of 89 aircraft in 2018, while the service life attrition will impact around 2038.

 

[davparlr]

They did - IIRC there wasn't going to be as much "stealth" emphasis with the aircraft proposed, basically a replacement for the B-1 or B-52.

Hmmm, I was working the program then but, while I did not work the proposal, I saw no effort to downsize the B-2 performance in any manner. I would have expected a pretty intensive costing effort. Redesigning the B-2 would have increased overhead cost in hardware, drawings, etc. All of these were complete for the baseline. I suspect it was strictly a stamp out, I think that would be the cheapest option, and most effective, option.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Hmmm, I was working the program then but, while I did not work the proposal, I saw no effort to downsize the B-2 performance in any manner. I would have expected a pretty intensive costing effort. Redesigning the B-2 would have increased overhead cost in hardware, drawings, etc. All of these were complete for the baseline. I suspect it was strictly a stamp out, I think that would be the cheapest option, and most effective, option.

IIRC some of the newspapers (Antelope Valley Press) reported that it would have been more of a "metal" aircraft - as we know that statements was just plain silly based on the way their aircraft was built and assembled.

I found this small blurb from the LA Times...

Northrop Offers to Add 40 B-2s to Air Force - latimes

 

[Capt. Vick]

The is a 14 year old article. Sadly they didn't take them up on it.