Who shot down the Red Baron?

[Pong]

90 years ago, the Manfred Von Richthofen was shot down in a mysterious death over Morlancourt ridge in France. Now the question remains, who really shot down the Baron, Captain Arthur "Roy" Brown, or Australian gunner Cedric Popkin?

-Pong

 

[wilbur1]

Im goin with Roy

 

[lesofprimus]

The guy on the ground had a higher probability of a lethal hit than Brown did....

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I'm going with Popkin but we will never know. It was probably a combination of both that brought him down.

 

[starling]

i understood he was shot down an r.a.f.pilot called..rhys-davis.yours.starling.

 

[Konigstiger205]

The details of the death of the Red Baron are sketchy and not so clear but from what I read in wikipedia I'll go with Popkin.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Rhys-Davis was KIA 6 months before Richthofen was shot down...

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

i understood he was shot down an r.a.f.pilot called..rhys-davis.yours.starling.

How is that possible when Arthur Percival Foley Rhys Davids was killed on Oct. 27, 1917. The Red Baron was shot down and killed on 21 April 1918.

Thats about a 6 month time period.

Arthur Percival Foley Rhys Davids was credited with shooting down Werner Voss on 23 Sept. 1917 though...

 

[starling]

must of been reading a different book. .or maybe the valium is kicking in. .

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

You probably got Richtofen confused with Voss. Davids did shoot down Voss in 1917.

 

[slaterat]

The eye witness testimony is inconclusive and contradictory in the shooting down of the Red Baron. For many years there has certainly been a movement to discredit Brown. IMHO most of the physical evidence supports Brown downing the Red Baron.

Slaterat

 

[Haztoys]

Anyone know what killed him as in was he hit in the head or heart or......?

I would "think" the round that killed him would not of been the same from ground and aircraft fire...???... I guess know one cared to look at that time ..

I have a real good old VHS tape on him .. I'll have to look at it again and see what it says..

 

[Soundbreaker Welch?]

They talk how the angle the bullet entered his body was not possible from Roy's position in his plane. But again, that could be bias agains't him, conspiracy theorists and all.

 

[kool kitty89]

He landed the plane intact before dying, right. (I remember hearin on a doccumentary that his plane was burned afterward but according to wikipedia it was picked apart for souvenirs)

 

[magnocain]

Snoopy
It was probily a combination of things. Maybe he had a stroke caused by his head injury not long before. Maybe he was tired of fighting and shot himself.

By the way when is the Red Baron movie coming out in the US?

 

[kool kitty89]

Snoopy

And here's what wikipedia has to say on it:

After ninety years of controversy and contradictory hypotheses, exactly who fired the fatal shot remains uncertain.

The RAF credited Brown with shooting down the Red Baron. However, Richthofen died following an extremely serious and inevitably fatal chest wound from a single bullet, penetrating from the right armpit and resurfacing next to the left nipple. If this was from Brown's guns, Richthofen simply could not have continued his pursuit of May for as long as he did.[12] Brown himself never spoke much about what happened that day, claiming "There is no point in me commenting, as the evidence is already out there".

Most experts now believe that Richthofen was killed by someone on the ground.[12][14] The wound through his body indicated that it had been caused by a bullet moving in an upward motion, from the right side, and more importantly, that it was probably received some time after Brown's attack.[12]

Many sources, including a 1998 article by Dr. Geoffrey Miller, a physician and historian of military medicine, and also a U.S. Public Broadcasting Service documentary made in 2003, have suggested that Sergeant Cedric Popkin was the person most likely to have killed Richthofen.[12][14] Popkin was an anti-aircraft (AA) machine gunner with the Australian 24th Machine Gun Company, and was using a Vickers gun. He fired at Richthofen's aircraft on two occasions: first as the Baron was heading straight at his position, and then at long range from the right. Popkin stated — in a 1935 letter, which included a sketch map — to the Australian official war historian, that he believed he had fired the fatal shot as Richthofen approached his position. Such a shot would have been from directly in front of the aircraft and could not have been the one that resulted in the Baron's death. However, Popkin was well placed to fire the fatal shot when Richthofen passed him for a second time on the right.[12][14]

One source, a 2002 documentary produced by the Discovery Channel suggests that Gunner W. J. "Snowy" Evans, a Lewis machine gunner with the 53rd Battery, 14th Field Artillery Brigade, Royal Australian Artillery is likely to have killed von Richthofen.[13] However, Dr. Miller and the PBS documentary dismiss these theories.[12][14]

Other sources have suggested that Gunner Robert Buie (also of the 53rd Battery) may have fired the fatal shot. There is now little support for this theory.[12][14] Nevertheless, in March 2007, the municipality of Hornsby Shire, in Sydney, recognised Buie, a former resident, as the man who shot down Richthofen. The Shire placed a plaque near Buie's former home in the suburb of Brooklyn.[15] Buie, who died in 1964, has never been officially recognised in any other way.

The commanding officer of No. 3 Squadron AFC, Major David Blake suggested initially that Richthofen had been killed by the crew of one of his squadron's R.E.8s, which had also fought Richthofen's unit that afternoon. However, this was quickly disproved, and, following an autopsy that he witnessed, Blake became a strong proponent of the view that an AA machine gunner had killed Richthofen.

Note W. J. "Snowy" Evans and Robert Buie of the 53rd Battery, 14th Field Artillery Brigade, Royal Australian Artillery are also mentioned.

also NOVA | Who Killed the Red Baron? | PBS

 

[Njaco]

I watched that docu...it was informative. Kinda like CSI: Richtohfen.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

He landed the plane intact before dying, right. (I remember hearin on a doccumentary that his plane was burned afterward but according to wikipedia it was picked apart for souvenirs)

Parts of his aircraft are in England and Canada.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

There's also remains of his aircraft in Australia

 

[Bigxiko]

i believe it was Sergeant Cedric Popkin