XM-8

Discussion in 'OFF-Topic / Misc.' started by cheddar cheese, Apr 29, 2005.

  1. cheddar cheese

    cheddar cheese Active Member

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    Does anyone know anything else about this gun? It seems kinda kick-ass, especially if you can have a combination of anything..

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Nonskimmer

    Nonskimmer Active Member

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    Ah, the planned M-16/M4 replacement! Very modular, eh?
    Should be something else, as long as all the kinks are worked out. :cool:
     
  3. cheddar cheese

    cheddar cheese Active Member

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    YEah it sure as heck sounds great 8)
     
  4. evangilder

    evangilder "Shooter"
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    Is it just me, or does the accessory "butt cap" sound a little unnerving? :shock:
     
  5. Nonskimmer

    Nonskimmer Active Member

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    :-k...Nah, I guess it's just you.

    :lol:
     
  6. evangilder

    evangilder "Shooter"
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  7. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    From the information that we have recieived on it. It is actually a very good rifle. It has many different configurations and is very light weight, easy to take apart and simple to fix. It does however like any advanced weapons system have some kinks but they will get them worked out. It is currently being tested against other experimental weapons by a team made up of soldiers form different backgrounds i.e. 1 Ranger, 1 Pilot, 1 cook, 1 mechanic, 1 medic....etc. So the soldiers get to decide what is going to be the next standard rifle. I will have to dig up an Army Times News Paper article on the different rifles they are testing and post it here. Very interesting stuff if my wife did not throw it out yet.
     
  8. plan_D

    plan_D Active Member

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    And it's almost a direct copy of the G-36 which will be equipping most European forces by 2008. America just doesn't like having the same so they got H K USA to develop a seperate model. Both the G-36 and XM-8 are H K though.
     
  9. Nonskimmer

    Nonskimmer Active Member

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    Basically it is, yeah. They've just made it modular and reconfigurable.
     
  10. plan_D

    plan_D Active Member

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    I like the looks of it. We'll have to see how well it performs though. It should be good, both the M-8 and G-36.
     
  11. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    I believe the G-36 is already being used by the German Bundeswehr. If I recall they showed it to us when we visited one of there posts a while back. It is probably just fielded limited right now for trials and tests but I think I have seen it before.
     
  12. Concorde247

    Concorde247 Member

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    It looks a good weapon, the fact that the Americans are testing it in this way with all different personnel using it makes perfect common sense.

    Shame the europeans didnt think of testing the SA80 in the same way - instead of giving our troops unreliable crap!
     
  13. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    It is the best way to test i think, you get a real soldiers opinion.
     
  14. Matt308

    Matt308 Glock Perfection
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    From what I have read is that the action makes use of M-16 parts. To what extent I don't know other than the bolt is virtually the same. Apparently this similarity is enough that Colt (another manufacturer in this competition) has put a temporary halt on the HK XM-8 until Colts lawsuit is resolved.

    The action apprarently makes use of the M-16 action, but with the short stroke piston (AK-47) in lieu of the gas impingement upon the bolt face (M-16). The modular weapon system includes a short carbine, rifle, squad auto, and heavy barrel machine gun.

    Other competitors included Robinson Arms, Armalite (apparently with a late submittal), and some others that escape me at the moment. What was most interesting to me is that with the exception of the XM-8, virtually all submittals looked just like an M-16/M-4 with lots of accessory rails hung all over it. Go figure.
     
  15. DAVIDICUS

    DAVIDICUS Member

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    THere is also apparently serious discussion about a new cartridge too. The 5.56mm NATO aka the civilian .223 Remington has been the subject of numeroius complaints from frontline soldiers, especially in Afghanastan, over failure to achieve one shot stops with center of mass hits.

    Remington, in conjunction with the military has developed the 6.8mm SPC (Special Purpose Cartridge) and is pitching it as a replacement for some, if not all 5.56mm NATO applications.

    The new 6.8mm cartridge fires a 115 gr. bullet at approximately 2,750 fps.

    The 5.56mm NATO fores a 62gr. bullet at about 3,100 fps.

    The new cartridge's dimensions are such that it can operate in the M-16 and related model platforms.

    Some of the military brass aren't sold on it. It should be interesting to see if it actually goes into operation.

    Left - 6.8 SPC / Right - 5.56 NATO
    [​IMG]
     
  16. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    One reason for this is. Tested in the field the 5.56 that is used to today just does not have eneogh stopping power. That is been one of the chief complaints by soldiers in combat. I personally do not know because I do not use a 5.56 weapon, but I know the same goes for my standard weapon the M-9 Baretta. Both do not have eneogh stopping power. I know for the M-9 I might as well throw my rounds at the enemy, I have a better chance of taking them out. The Army is also looking to replace the M-9 with something that has more stopping power such as going back to the Colt 45 or an HK.

    Also as you were saying on the current M-4 and M-16 platforms, the parts are not interchangable. They want it to be like the AK-47 which was like so and had stopping power.

    Here is some info on the XM-8. I dont think I will get the chance to test it out and tell you my opinion on it because before it goes into service I will be out of the army.


    XM-8 Prototype Specifications

    Caliber:
    5.56 x 45mm NATO

    Builder:
    Heckler Koch

    Weight:
    6.4 lbs (prototype),
    5.7 lbs objective

    Overall Length:
    33.3 inches (carbine stock extended)

    Barrel Length:
    Assault: 12.5"
    Sharpshooter: 20.0"
    Compact: 9.0"
    Automatic Rifle: 20.0"

    Rate of Fire:
    Cyclic - 750 rpm
    Sustained - 85 rpm up to 210 rounds

    Rate of Twist:
    1 in 7 inches

    Barrel Life:
    20,000 rounds mininum

    Muzzle Velocity:
    3005 feet/second (M855 Ball) with 20" barrel
    2675 feet/second with 12.5" barrel
    2365 feet/second with 9.0" barrel

    Magazine Capacity:
    10 or 30 rounds (magazines can be nested together); 100 round drum available

    Stock:
    5 position adjustable for length

    Bayonet Lug:
    Yes (12.5 20" barrels)

    Bipod Interface:
    Yes (20" only)

    Sighting System:
    Fully integrated red dot with laser illuminator and pointer

    Below are different ways the XM-8 can be configured.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. DAVIDICUS

    DAVIDICUS Member

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    DerAdlerIstGelandet said, " I know for the M-9 I might as well throw my rounds at the enemy, I have a better chance of taking them out. The Army is also looking to replace the M-9 with something that has more stopping power such as going back to the Colt 45 or an HK. "

    It is said that a pistol is only for use while you're getting your rifle. I have not heard anything about a serious movement to replace the 9mm as the standard pistol cartridge. You don't engage the enemy that often with a pistol. Even in close quarters like inside a house.

    The 9mm shoots considerably flatter than the .45 due to its significantly higher velocity. I don't think it's that much less lethal than the .45. A single center of mass hit with either can be fatal. The .45 has a very large cross-section that can prove detrimental in penetration. During the Korean conflict, there were accounts of enemy soldiers whose heavy winter clothing actually stopped .45 rounds from Thompsons. I suspect that these were at longer ranges though.

    I do know that some special forces use the .45 instead of the 9mm for their sidearms so take my personal experiences with both with a grain of salt.

    I know that disatisfaction with the 9mm is quite common with soldiers. Part of it though (in my opinion) stems from the psychological impression that the .45 has. The 1911A1 pistol has a large diameter hole in the barrel of .45 as opposed to .35 inches and its individual rounds weigh considerably more at 230 grains as opposed to 124 grains. Thus, it just seems more lethal.

    There was a similar disatisfaction when the armed forces went from the 7.62X51 NATO to the 5.56X43 NATO round for the main combat weapon. The new cartridge was bad mouthed before it's effectiveness was ever exstensively tested in combat.

    The current cries of disatisfaction did not arise until the Afghanastan campaign. In that threatre, the longer engagement ranges of 300 yards plus in conjunction with the shorter barreled M-4 with its reduction in muzzle velocity revealed the shortcoming of the little .22 cal bullet. It relies heavily on high velocity for its ability to impart terminal hydrostatic shock.
     
  18. BombTaxi

    BombTaxi Active Member

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    I know Ive never been proper military, but I was a cadet weapons instructor, and I sure as hell wouldnt want to be on the sharp end of a 5.56mm round. A buddy of mine saw a regular get taken down with one in a range accident, and from what he said, the guy was lucky to survive. Those rounds leave terrible exit wounds, and the fact that they're intended to wound rather than kill makes them even worse, IMHO. All I know is that when some jackass cadet decided to point a weapon at me, I had no qualms about putting him down...I wasnt willing to risk stopping one of those things, cos I was taught that you feel every second of it :shock:

    But, slightly more on topic, the XM8/G36 package does seem to be a good piece of kit. The sooner the British Army ditch the L8x family the better...even the cadet (bolt-action) versions used to jam every 5 minutes :rolleyes:
     
  19. plan_D

    plan_D Active Member

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    Those from the Battle of Black Sea complained about the 5.56 failing to stop their enemy. The Delta using the CAR-15s had titanium tipped rounds, it would go straight through with little internal damage.

    What Britain needs is the SLR back, that'll stop you one shot. 7.62mm... :twisted:
     
  20. DerAdlerIstGelandet

    DerAdlerIstGelandet Der Crew Chief
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    For someone like myself whos primary weapon , that means I dont carry a rifle. I depend on my M-9. And it has no stopping power. the weapon sucks. The army has been toying around with the prospet for several years now to replace it. Here is an artical from the Army Times about it.

    And this artical below, I can agree with because I have had the same problem not matter how much maintenance I perform on my M-9.


    I know as someone who does not use the M-16/M-4. I can not talk to much about it. However the M-9 really does blow, trust me I used it every day for a year in Iraq. It is my primary weapon. I would rather have a Glock or HK. If I can find the other Army Times artical about it, I will post it, but it talks about how the army is looking at the HK right now.
     
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