"Zerstörer" specification, but as an 1-engined fighter (2 Viewers)

I think you are optimistic on Bf.113 Performance:

I didn't complete some of the cells as they aren't critical; Hurricane performance is for fixed pitch propeller on 87 octane - what the Luftwaffe encountered during the BoF. As may be seen, both Luftwaffe fighters enjoy a substantial performance advantage.

For the BoB, the Hurricane has been upgraded with CS propeller and 100 octane fuel - performance is very close to Bf.110 (individual aircraft are probably better/worse)

The Bf.109 basically gets 4 mpg whether internal or internal + drop tank. So, to fly 560 miles, it needs 140 Imp gal. For the Bf.113 with annual radiator, assuming the same 66 Imp gal fuselage tank of the Bf.109G-12, you need 74 gal in wings. There is space in the wings for 37 gal/side between main and rear spar but:


The Bf.113 has performance equal to BoF Hurricane and inferior to BoB uprated ones.

If Bf.110 struggled in BoB, the Bf.113 is going to struggle in BoF and going to be in real trouble in BoB. And it's going to be too slow and too short ranged to be a decent night fighter (Ju.88 and He.219 had much greater range and so were better night fighters for average pilot)

don4331 said:

I think you are optimistic on Bf.113 Performance:
I didn't complete some of the cells as they aren't critical; Hurricane performance is for fixed pitch propeller on 87 octane - what the Luftwaffe encountered during the BoF. As may be seen, both Luftwaffe fighters enjoy a substantial performance advantage.

For the BoB, the Hurricane has been upgraded with CS propeller and 100 octane fuel - performance is very close to Bf.110 (individual aircraft are probably better/worse)

Click to expand...

Hurricane was doing just under 320 mph with the better prop. 100 oct fuel will not matter above ~16000 ft.
I think I'm realistic of the 113 performance, my ballpark was the D4Y1, that was good for 330 mph on the very similar engine as what the LW fighters used in 1939. Note that the 113 I was suggesting is a bit smaller fighter than the Hurricane, with a thinner wing and with better radiator set-up and exhausts. So if anything, I was being conservative.
Or, a tad slower Re.2001 or P-40B/C.

don4331 said:

The Bf.109 basically gets 4 mpg whether internal or internal + drop tank. So, to fly 560 miles, it needs 140 Imp gal. For the Bf.113 with annual radiator, assuming the same 66 Imp gal fuselage tank of the Bf.109G-12, you need 74 gal in wings. There is space in the wings for 37 gal/side between main and rear spar but:
The Bf.113 is carrying navigator/radio operator/rear gunner (requirement of Zerstörer specification).

Click to expand...

I've noted several times now that fuel tank(s) should be under the cockpit (again, cue the Judy, just with the thinner belly that is not a bomb bay but a place for tanks). Fuselage was probably the best place for the fuel tanks for the fighters, especially once self-sealing was in play, since the % lost due to the thicker material was the lowest.
The much bigger wings of the 113 (when compared with Bf 109) should allow for the growth of fuel tankage for the later day.

Bf 109E was already a draggy aircraft, let alone with a drop tank.

don4331 said:

tomo pauk also specified the same 2 - MG FF and 4 - MF 17 from Bf.110; upgrading from MG 17 to MG FF added 100 lbs from Bf.109E-0 to Bf.109E-3The end result by my napkin calculations is the Bf.113 is 700lbs heavier; so it needs Wing area increase 30% over Bf.109 to maintain equal wing loading. Cube root suggests ~10% increase in drag. So, now we need 154 gal (700 litres); 44gal per side for same range.

Click to expand...

See Re.2001. It was getting 1040 km at 375 km/h, or 890 km at 440 km/h. All for 400 kg of fuel (~530L).
Or P-40B - with 120 gals (~454L), it was supposed to do 620 miles (~1000 km) on 'operating speed' of 306 mph.

I've suggested 600L of fuel for the 113.

don4331 said:

The Bf.113 has performance equal to BoF Hurricane and inferior to BoB uprated ones.

If Bf.110 struggled in BoB, the Bf.113 is going to struggle in BoF and going to be in real trouble in BoB. And it's going to be too slow and too short ranged to be a decent night fighter (Ju.88 and He.219 had much greater range and so were better night fighters for average pilot)

Click to expand...

The 113 can also be uprated, and by installing the DB 601N engines, as well as by increasing the revs on the DB 601A. It will be far easier to up-engine the 113 fleet than the historical 110 fleet, by the simple virtue of needing less engines.
Some of the shortcoings of the 110 will also not be here now, like the big size (easier to spot it and act accordingly; easier to hit it), less of the blind spots since there is no nacelles and the wing is smaller, better rate of roll (again since there is no big weight of the engines away from the centreline, and the wing is much smaller).
One of the resons the Bf 110 was not all what it was expected was also that there was just a small number of them, so once the Bf 109s needed to head home, the LR force was badly outnumbered. The 113s main advantage IMO is that they can solve the problem of low numbers of the LR fighters, so that problem of being outnumbered is much smaller.