ZG 1, Italy and the Bf 110G-2?

Discussion in '#3 MTO/North Africa' started by Lucky13, Aug 20, 2009.

  1. Lucky13

    Lucky13 Forum Mascot

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    36,719
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Nightshift picker
    Location:
    A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland
    Home Page:
    Having bought the Eduard 1/48 Bf 110G-2 for the 5./ZG 1, Monte Covino, Italy - Summer, 1943, I was wondering, were they all camouflaged in the greys like S9+FN?

    Did any of their '110's ever carry a desert camouflage with the wespe noseart?
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Maximowitz

    Maximowitz Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,971
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    Railwayman
    Location:
    London, England.
    "Paging Evgeny, can Evgeny please answer the white courtesy phone...." :D
     
  3. Evgeny Velichko

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2009
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    #3 Evgeny Velichko, Aug 20, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
    Yes, lucky, You are right.

    Actually, all Daylight heavy fighters of G version (G-2), was painted in factory in 74/75/76.

    When they come to regiments, they could just be mottled a bit, and theatre bands could be added. Thats all.

    As for sand/broun sceme for Bf110, it seems that it produced many mistakes, even in colour profiles.

    You know, in old colour photos, every colour (even RLM 76 blue/gray) will look a bit more yellow when there is a sand/rocks (yellow colours) on the background. This effect is often seen on III./ZG26 photos when it was baced in Greece, and of course in Africa. Also, there is severla pictures of Wespen in Italy, when 74/75 is more yellower as usual. After it, many artists paint theyr colour profiles with sand/broun colors instead of violetgray/greengray.

    II./ZG1 when it was in Italy was equipped only with Bf110G-2. It had thin white fuselage band close to horisontal stabiliser, yellow RLM04 wingtips&engine colwing (oil radiator area), and usual Wespe emblem. So, S9+FN is correct, as Bf110G-2/Trop of 5./ZG1.

    +EU is a 13./JG5 mashine, 1944. Yellow/black RVT band point on this.
    +IN could be 5./ZG76 mashine, late 1943.

    In 1944, ZG1, ZG26 and ZG76 got new style of RVT bands. It became wide (as You could se below), ZG1 got white band, ZG26 - red, and ZG76 - yellow.
    2n+MN is for sure Bf110G-2 of 5./ZG1, 1944, Reich Defence.
    m8+KM is for sure Bf110G-2/R1 of 4./ZG76, Reich defence. It is known that several Bf110G-2/R1 (with 3,7 sm cannon) were in test flights with 4./ZG76.

    Wh
     
  4. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,543
    Likes Received:
    1,414
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
    Geat info here Evgeny.Thank you for that.:D
     
  5. imalko

    imalko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2009
    Messages:
    3,669
    Likes Received:
    92
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Vojvodina, Serbia
    #5 imalko, Aug 20, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
    Echo Wojtek's post, great info Evgeny. One question though, how come that Bf 110s in 1943 in Italy had yellow wingtips? Wasn't this the feature only of the Eastern front aircraft at this time in the war?
     
  6. Evgeny Velichko

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2009
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    II./ZG1 got this, as they got theyr new produced Bf110G-2's standing in Krasnodar, Kuban region, Osfront.

    When they flew to Italy, they just overpainted fuselage band from yellow to white.
     
  7. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,543
    Likes Received:
    1,414
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
  8. Lucky13

    Lucky13 Forum Mascot

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    36,719
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Nightshift picker
    Location:
    A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland
    Home Page:
    Wow! :shock: Thanks a lot Evgeny, great info! Appreciated! I really, REALLY hope that the '110 will arrive before or on Saturday, eager to open the box and have a look! :oops:
     
  9. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    13,090
    Likes Received:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Platonic Sphere
    #9 Erich, Aug 20, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
    actually according to stats the 3,7cm was used by all 3 defense units and the ZG 26 band was not wide but narrow to make difference between it and ZG1's II gruppe wide white band. (ZG 26 band was also white as well, photos confirm this) All three defense units experimented with a truck load of different cannon configs including outboard single 2cm waffen pods, and belly mounted 2-4 barrel 2cm and twin 3cm units; rockets well that is another story as the tech crews went crazy with further testing
     
  10. Lucky13

    Lucky13 Forum Mascot

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    36,719
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Nightshift picker
    Location:
    A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland
    Home Page:
    Thanks Erich, appreciated! So, S9+FN could at some point in life have been equipped with something similar to what you see on +KM? Is that a single 37mm?
     
  11. Evgeny Velichko

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2009
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Yep, You are right :) Also, I./ZG26 used numbers instead of letters on theyr Bf110's.

    My memory mistake...
     
  12. Evgeny Velichko

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2009
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    II./ZG1 didnt used Bk3,7 in Italy.

    Avtually, this cannon was first seen in action when 5./ZG1 got several aircrafts, in spring 43. Then, from those a/c was formed Pz.Jg.St./ZG1, under command of I./Zg1, and flew in Citadel operation, wich confirmed useless of this cannon for tank hunt.

    Later in autumn 43, all survived crews and aircrafts of this Staffel were assigned to 4./ZG76.

     
  13. Lucky13

    Lucky13 Forum Mascot

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    36,719
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Nightshift picker
    Location:
    A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland
    Home Page:
    Right, cheers Evgeny, appreciated! Any idea what other weapon pods could be found on the ZG1 '110's in Italy, appropiate for their machines?
     
  14. Evgeny Velichko

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2009
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    As they flew ground attack missions mainly, so it must be underbelly bombrack and wing bombracks.
     
  15. Erich

    Erich the old Sage
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    May 20, 2004
    Messages:
    13,090
    Likes Received:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Platonic Sphere
    Evgeny : according to the losses listing of I./ZG 26 of which I own it was only on the air battle of December 11, 1943 when the I. gruppe started to use coloured numerals. In October/November of 1943 they were still using the two letter code.

    E ~
     
  16. Lucky13

    Lucky13 Forum Mascot

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    36,719
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Nightshift picker
    Location:
    A Swede living in Glasgow, Scotland
    Home Page:

    Attached Files:

  17. vikingBerserker

    vikingBerserker Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2009
    Messages:
    24,064
    Likes Received:
    655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Korporate Kontrolleur
    Location:
    South Carolina
  18. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    51,151
    Likes Received:
    846
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Adelaide Sth. Aust.
  19. Micdrow

    Micdrow “Archive”
    Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Messages:
    7,711
    Likes Received:
    416
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Occupation:
    Manufacture Tech
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Your as bad as me Jan, you got the color scheme worked out. :D Are you looking for a specific aircraft as I have this book
     

    Attached Files:

  20. Maximowitz

    Maximowitz Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,971
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    Railwayman
    Location:
    London, England.
    Ah, Mr Vasco's mighty book on SKG 210... he's a nice guy and guitar player too. Bf 110 fan and guitarist. An excellent combination. :lol:
     
Loading...

Share This Page