Grumman Guardian XTB3F-1

[special ed]

I am about to refinish a flying scale model of the prototype Grumman Guardian the XTB3F-1 which I received from another modeler who painted it overall silver. Pulling naval fighters #20 from my library, I find a mystery I hope the readers here can give advice. In the text, author Kowalski says rudder was painted red, in the photo caption page 2. Caption on page 8 center photo also says " red control surfaces". The back cover of the book shows a color photo with control surfaces in Gloss Sea Blue as I would have expected since Grumman was painting current production aircraft gloss sea blue and the dope for fabric control surfaces match. My question is why would Grumman find red dope for the control surfaces on this prototype? Is Kowalski in error? A possible clue is the color photo shows post 1947 star and bar while the B/W photos show late wartime insignia. The text says proto 1st flight 19 Dec 1946 and stricken from inventory 31 Mar 1949. In those three years, would the control surfaces have been recovered and painted gloss sea blue? I would prefer to keep the late war style national insignia. Anyone with Grumman colors experience?

 

[Wurger]

I'm not sure which pic you are talking abut but it is possible the Grumman could use the red colour for the prototype. It wouldn't be strange I would say. However later the control surfaces could be either repainted or just the another plane of the prototype series could get the blue coat there. So it would be nice to know if both pics show the same aircraft. I have looked via the net for pics of the plane and found this ..

The enlarged part with the rudder reveals that the rudder could have been of the blue colour rather while the front part of the fin tip and the rudder trailing edge look like being of the red. Of course I'm not sure at 100% that the red pieces were there but I'm quite sure the rudder wasn't of the red at that time. Additionally the port aileron tip seen in the enlarged pic indicates the blue there.

the pic source: Forums / USAAF / USN Library / THE AF GUARDIAN - Axis and Allies Paintworks

 

[special ed]

I agree. I have this photo in the book, Naval Fighters no 20 , the back cover of which, shows the color shot in post 1947 markings with gloss sea blue colors on control surfaces. The first prototype bu/no 90504 is the one in question. Since by 1946 color film was easily available to Grumman, I wonder if color shots might show the answer. Calls to Grumman public relations and several other depts, I was given short answers and finally, in public relations, a rather abrupt woman said "They threw all that away". Apparently, the only way they will talk to is if I will buy a fleet of planes. There has to be a site for Grumman archives but I can't find it.

 

[Wurger]

Yep. Here you are two pics of the another kite. The B&W pic is dated on 1949. The colour shot show the same plane ( IMHO the image was taken also in 1949 ) and the control surfaces are of the blue coat. We can discuss the tone of the panels at the wing leading edges but it might have been blue as well. However I would say it could have been of NMF and could be the light trick. Especially if we compare the tone of the panels to the fin tip that was of the NMF.

The pic source: Forums / USAAF / USN Library / THE AF GUARDIAN - Axis and Allies Paintworks

And here is an enlarged shot of the two Grumman Guardians but national markings are different form those seen in pic above. I would say the shot was taken in 1946 or 1947. The tone of both rudders indicates the blue there rather than the red.

the pic source: Grumman's Guardian - Flight Journal

 

[fubar57]

This site, 2nd hit down goes back to 1996...Wayback Machine

 

[special ed]

The dates in that forum don't match Kowalski's book, but color shots show, logically, control surfaces in gloss sea blue. Thanks for the info on that site, Wurger and Fubar. I'm going with gloss sea blue on the control surfaces.