How should we rate the Beaufighter?

[Koopernic]

The Mosquito wasn't smaller than the Beaufighter.




The Griffon wouldn't have been available in sufficient numbers, irrespective of whether it was to be used for other aircraft, when the Beaufighter II was produced.

The mosquito had less accessible and contiguous space for mounting radar equipment, it would require a greater effort to package the electronics. The internal space of the Beaufighter was perfect for mounting electronics which had not yet been carefully packaged and miniaturised. Such efforts require time.

At any rate the radar engineers remarked that they found it a convenient aircraft to work with.

There were only 300 Merlin Beaufighters produced so it might not have been too taxing to use the Griffon.

A Griffon Beaufighter might have addressed criticisms of the aircrafts limited speed.

 

[Kryten]

I don't think the Griffon would have added anything as the Hercules was already producing 1400HP and 1650HP was on the way, and with a better CoG to boot.

 

[Koopernic]

I don't think the Griffon would have added anything as the Hercules was already producing 1400HP and 1650HP was on the way, and with a better CoG to boot.

My recollection from Spitfire Mk XII data is that the single stage supercharged Griffon was producing 1850hp at the time and I would assume it was with less drag than the Hercules. The ultra long nacelles of the Beaufighter were to overcome a vibration problem. The Griffon of course grew in power to well over 2000, Im sure it always had somewhat more than the Hercules but less than the Centaurus.

 

[Kryten]

That's 1943 though isn't it when Hercules was making 1700+?

 

[Koopernic]

That's 1943 though isn't it when Hercules was making 1700+?

Griffons were in the air in 1941 on prototypes such as the Spitfire IV and Firefly, earliest service date I have is October 1942 for Griffon IIB powered Spitfire XII. These engines were rated to 1730 hp. Spitfire XII latter received the 1850hp Griffon IV in 1943.

My thought is that a Griffon powered Beaufighter would have kept the aircraft relevant longer.

 

[wuzak]

Griffons were in the air in 1941 on prototypes such as the Spitfire IV and Firefly, earliest service date I have is October 1942 for Griffon IIB powered Spitfire XII. These engines were rated to 1730 hp. Spitfire XII latter received the 1850hp Griffon IV in 1943.

My thought is that a Griffon powered Beaufighter would have kept the aircraft relevant longer.

The problem there is that the Merlin Beaufighter was in service a year earlier.

October 1942 was the first delivery of a production Spitfire XII. They didn't become operational until 1943.

The first production Beaufighter II was delivered in April 1942.

The Griffon would never have been able to fill the gap that the Merlin did. That is, the possible supply issues with the Hercules.

By the time the Griffon was available, Hercules supply was secured.

 

[Shortround6]

While the Hercules radials were certainly far from low drag the big problem on the Beaufighter was the wing. Initial estimate using under 1400hp Hercules engines was for 370mph. Similar drag assumptions as the Typhoon.

For a plane of it's size the Beaufighter was practically an STOL machine. A MK X could take-off and clear a 50 obstacle in 760 yds while carrying an 18in torpedo.

You were going to need an awful lot of power to get it go much faster.

 

[parsifal]

Here are the performance data sheets for the Beau

Beaufighter T. F. X. Testing

Note the high speed of the mk x whilst carrying a torpedo.

It had a modest top speed overall, but its performance even when loaded with a torpedo was impressive. Suggests to me it had plenty of power, but some issues with its aerodynamics.

 

[vinnye]

All told, not as glamorous as the Mossie, but a critical aircraft early war for the Allies, and which still had a useful role even at wars end.

One of the all time greats which a bit like the Hurricane gets forgotten.

This is exactly the point that I was making in my original post. That the Beaufighter was a very capable aircraft but it did not appear to be as glamorous as the Mosquito. You could say the same about the Hurricane and Spitfire and possibly the P47 and P51?

 

[Shortround6]

It is not quite a question of "glamorous". In your 3 examples the more "glamorous" aircraft is also a later aircraft in terms of design/construction. As a result they were more capable.
Nobody was going to strap a 4000lb cookie to a Beuafighter and fly to Berlin. Doesn't mean it didn't do good work in other roles but whenever speed was needed or the ability to stand up to first rate single engine fighters it wasn't the first pick.
The Hurricane was pretty much a done deal as a fighter by the Spring of 1942 against just about anybody, doesn't mean it didn't do a lot of good work in it's other role of ground attack.
P-47 lasted longer but the P-51 that made the P-51 famous used an engine that didn't exist when the P-47 was first designed/developed. And used a fuel that didn't exist in 1940/early 1941.

 

[pbehn]

For a brief period the Hurricane was the darling of the British public, then when the Spitfire was unveiled it stole the show, long before any shot was fired in anger.

 

[taly01]

As a young Australian kid the Beaufighter was the glamour plane, it was very effective anti-shipping and attack plane and it was faster than Japanese fighters at low altitude, plus it just looks tougher than the Mosquito.

The observation/rear gunner dome up on the Beaufighters spine was useful to spot shipping and something the Mosquito didn't have.

 

[nuuumannn]

A Griffon Beaufighter might have addressed criticisms of the aircrafts limited speed.

The biggest problem with the Beaufighter II was not its speed, but its bad handling, which one pilot described as 'evil'; the Beau II was a real handfull and this was the cause of a number of deaths. Their introduction into service was plagued with malfunctioning radar equipment and the type's terrible handling, owing to those enormous Merlins placed too far ahead of the cockpit, which diced with the aircraft's c of g. The Griffon Beau was proposed as a means of increasing the type's altitude and one was converted, Mk.IIF T3177, but nothing came of it. Simultaneously, the two Mk.II prototypes went to Rolls-Royce as test beds fitted with (Two-speed, two stage supercharged) Merlin 61s for the same reason.

...kept it relevant for longer.

I don't believe the Beaufighter was ever considered irrelevant. The Herc powered Beaufighter VI and X were superb aircraft that get overshadowed by the Mossie for no good reason. Although the type did suffer instability issues throughout its career, they weren't beyond the measure of average pilots. The Mossie didn't like having a torpedo slung underneath it and if I can remember correctly, one or two of the Strike Wing squadrons that equipped with Mossie torpedo bombers switched back to the Beaufighter because of the Mossie's dislike of a big draggy thing spoiling its lines.

The first production Beaufighter II was delivered in April 1942.

A year earlier; 1941.

 

[Greyman]

... and if I can remember correctly, one or two of the Strike Wing squadrons that equipped with Mossie torpedo bombers switched back to the Beaufighter because of the Mossie's dislike of a big draggy thing spoiling its lines.

I had read the Beaufighter was preferred over the Mosquito in attacks on Norwegian fjords - its superior turning coming into play.

 

[buffnut453]

The Mossie didn't like having a torpedo slung underneath it and if I can remember correctly, one or two of the Strike Wing squadrons that equipped with Mossie torpedo bombers switched back to the Beaufighter because of the Mossie's dislike of a big draggy thing spoiling its lines.

The Mossie never flew operationally in the torpedo carrying role. Coastal Command Mossies primarily carried rockets and bombs, with the cannons used as a little extra firepower. The Mk XVIII also carried the Molins 6-pounder anti-tank gun in the anti-shipping role. The only Mossie designed to carry torpedoes was the Sea Mosquito TR.33 but it was too late for operations and only 50 were built.

 

[Glider]

The Beaufighter was one of the most underrated aircraft of the war with a number of firsts to her name.

a) The worlds first true nightfighter
b) The RAF's first long range strike aircraft
c) The only fighter to use torpedo's on a regular basis in combat
d) Was an anti shipping strike aircraft of the first order
e) She was in every area of combat as a reliable workhorse

The UK would have been in a difficult position had she not been around

 

[nuuumannn]

The Mossie never flew operationally in the torpedo carrying role. Coastal Command Mossies primarily carried rockets and bombs, with the cannons used as a little extra firepower.

Ooops, my bad; that is true.

I agree, Glider; the Beaufighter is underrated now, with the passing of time; but was held in high regard during the war and was of significant importance.