Lancaster Insignia - Circle with Crown

[Back2TheBike]

My first post on this forum as a newbie ...
I'm trawling my late father's photographs and found these, which I'm struggling to identify.
He was first posted to 582 Pathfinders at Little Staughton - September 1945 - after gaining his wings in BCATP (Commonwealth Air Training Plan) Canada.
Note no guns, 'B376' registration, H2S radome.
I have three possibilities:

1. Canadian Lanc, part of BCATP?
2. Ferrying troops home from Bari, Italy at the war's close?
3. Bomb disposal (I have a photo of him over the North Sea, bomb doors open on BD)?

Any help gratefully received
Neil

 

[Wurger]

The B376 is not the registration but its serial. IMHO it is seen partially only and it should be PB376. If I'm correct here is the service history of her. The Lancaster is Type 683 B Mk.I She was built by A.V. Roe & Co Ltd under Contract no. 1807 , the first batch. Deliveries commenced May 1944 and completed Sep 1944. Judging by the markings I would say it is summer or slightly latter in 1945 ( hence the lack of the guns) . So ... the no.97 and 83 squadron should be taken into consideration. The white serial on the undersides indicates the time frame after the August 1945 when the applying of the serials on the bottom surface of the wings was restored. What is more there can be noticed the Lanc of the s/n. ND824 in the middle image. According to my notes the Lancaster serial is assiociated with the no.83 Squadron. What is more, both squadrons used quite similar squadron code letters. The no.97 - OF while the no.83 - OL. Additionally both units based at the RAF Coningsby from April 1944 and belonged to the same 5 PFF Target marking Group.

the source: Lancaster – Bomber Command History.

 

[Back2TheBike]

That's really helpful, thank you.
His service record places him with 83 Sqn and anecdotally I believe he was at Coningsby.
Just need to puzzle out those strange insignia now!
Best regards
Neil

 

[EwenS]

That's really helpful, thank you.
His service record places him with 83 Sqn and anecdotally I believe he was at Coningsby.
Just need to puzzle out those strange insignia now!
Best regards
Neil

Most probably the squadron badge.

 

[Wurger]

The strange insignia isn't the odd at all. I agree with EwenS. It is a kind of an unofficial badge ( possible not finished yet). Here is a similar one used by no.50 Squadron.

and the official of both squadrons ...

the source: the net.

 

[Back2TheBike]

The strange insignia isn't the odd at all. I agree with EwenS. It is a kind of an unofficial badge ( possible not finished yet). Here is a similar one used by no.50 Squadron.

View attachment 802414

and the official of both squadrons ...

View attachment 802416
the source: the net.

Ah, seems logical. I knew he repatriated troops from the North Africa campaign via Bari, Italy, so did wonder if this was the aircraft, guns removed to lighten it.

 

[Wurger]

Ah, seems logical. I knew he repatriated troops from the North Africa campaign via Bari, Italy, so did wonder if this was the aircraft, guns removed to lighten it.

The pics you posted aren't the greatest copies but if the badge is enlarged and you have a close up look at the inner part of the emblem can be noticed. IMHO that's the "deer horn" seen in the official crest. However it is inverted. The brown colour is possible so it is almost unnoticeable in the pics.

 

[Back2TheBike]

The pics you posted aren't the greatest copies but if the badge is enlarged and you have a close up look at the inner part of the emblem can be noticed. IMHO that's the "deer horn" seen in the official crest. However it is inverted. The brown colour is possible so it is almost unnoticeable in the pics.

View attachment 802434

View attachment 802431
View attachment 802433

Makes sense. The original image is a 3" x 2". I've just had a play in Photoshop (adjusted the lighting curve, high pass filter/hardlight) and got this. Seems to fit your theory.
Also, just cross-checked dad's serviv record, which states '83 Squadron date of movement 12/3/46 - 30/7/46' (posted to Bruntingthorpe).
I requested an anlaysis from the MoD Air Historical Branch after receiving his servicce record. The analyst states '83 Sqdn = No 83 Squadron, RAF Coningsby, Lincolnshire, No 1 Group, Bomber Command. Lancaster MkI and Mk III aircraft'.

 

[Wurger]

And that's the same I found via the net sources.

Just also found this ...

06/07/1945, Lancaster, PB376, 97sqn, Coningsby. This aircraft was damaged at 0015hrs on take-off for a fighter affiliation sortie. The aircraft swung slightly to port, the pilot over-corrected and the aircraft swung to starboard. The undercarriage was strained in this incident. Pilot F/O W Laycock and crew were uninjured.

the source: the net.

 

[Back2TheBike]

And that's the same I found via the net sources.

Just also found this ...

06/07/1945, Lancaster, PB376, 97sqn, Coningsby. This aircraft was damaged at 0015hrs on take-off for a fighter affiliation sortie. The aircraft swung slightly to port, the pilot over-corrected and the aircraft swung to starboard. The undercarriage was strained in this incident. Pilot F/O W Laycock and crew were uninjured.

View attachment 802440
the source: the net.

At least they can't blame dad

 

[Wurger]

And something more ..

No.97 (Straits Settlements) Squadron
Coningsby
13 February 1945
ATTACK ON DRESDEN

Lancaster III "S" PB376 F/O T W Noon
Time Up 18.24 Time Down 03.18
Load 12 x C.P. No.1
5 x R/P Flares Green/Red
8–9/10ths cloud, slight breaks. Target identified on H2S.
Dropped flares blind as briefed. Green T.I. a little early. One
Red T.I. cascaded at about 8,000ft, before P.B.M. went down.
Controller told LINK 1 to tell Main Force to come below
medium cloud at 15,000ft and bomb Red T.I. glow according
to plan. One stick of bombs apparently went wide.

So the PB376 was coded OF-S while servicing in the no.97 Squadron.

 

[SaparotRob]

Amazing.

 

[Wurger]

And attack on targets in Harburg/Hamburg area ...

No.97 Squadron
Lancaster III PB376 F/O E Yaxley 18.12 00.34
Target located on H2S. Emergency Wave not required. Went straight through
and bombed as briefed. One terrific explosion in the target area at 21.58½
hrs

 

[Wurger]

To sume up ...

the PB376 Lancaster seems to be marked with the no.83 emblem ...
she was moved to the squadron from no.97one in March 1946 ( according to the service history ) ...
she also is parked next to the ND824 that was the no.83 squadron plane ...
no armament in the front turret installed ...
the white underwing serial is restored ( the order in August 1945 ) ...

I would say ... the three pics were taken in the late summer 1945 or in 1946. Both the no.83 Squadron and no.97 one based in the RAF Coningsby together at that time. Also it is possible the pics could be taken at the RAF Wroughton where the 15th MU was based. It looks like both ND824 and PB376 were sent there for scrapping in July 1946. Anyway, a post-war time period.

 

[Back2TheBike]

I would say ... the three pics were taken in the late summer 1945 or in 1946

Based on his Service Record it is March-July 1946, thus Coningsby. No record or anecdotal evidence he went to Wroughton (a place ironically I regularly zip through on my Ducati ...)
I've spent the morning searching for Coningsby's Record Site Plan. I have a photo of dad and crew member with structures behind. If I can nail this to Coningsby then we can be 100% certain.
Your wisdom is much appreciated.