P36 vs Hurricane

[Juha2]

Yes, P-36 was slow but still the Adl'A H-75As did a little better than the RAF Hurricane Is against Bf 109Es during the Battle of France in 1940. It wasn't a Spitfire or 109 but this thread is P36 vs Hurricane.

 

[Shortround6]

The are a lot variables between the the Battle of France and the Battle of Britain including perhaps pilot experience/training and average height of combat.
Both the British and French air forces were expanding tremendously in late 30s and a lot of the pilots are going to be low time ones. Perhaps the French pilots got better gunnery training? Perhaps the Hawks had their guns all pointed in the same direction?

The Germans were flying a lot more low level missions in support of the ground troops in France and their fighters may have been a lower levels. the low altitude engines of the Hawks (and the two speed Cyclone wasn't any lower than the DB601) may not have been a large disadvantage in France. I have not seen a breakdown of the claims of the French Hawks, as in how many 109s, how many He 111s, how many Ju 87s how many Fi 126s etc.

Expecting the Hawk to do as well over England where, in general, the altitudes were higher and their were fewer 'tactical' aircraft flying may be a different story.

 

[Juha2]

Hello SR
a very short answer. I agree with your first point, but I refered to the real results in Hurri vs 109 contra Hawk 75A vs 109 combats as counted from Cornwell's BoF T&N by JoeB, see:

DeWoitone D.520 vs. Spitfire Bf-109

Juha

 

[fastmongrel]

Hello SR
a very short answer. I agree with your first point, but I refered to the real results in Hurri vs 109 contra Hawk 75A vs 109 combats as counted from Cornwell's BoF T&N by JoeB, see:

DeWoitone D.520 vs. Spitfire Bf-109

Juha

Peter Cornwells The Battle of France Then and Now is a book I have been after for a while unfortunately copies are going for over £45.00 on Amazon at the moment and dont often turn up on 2nd hand booksites.

 

[buffnut453]

Peter Cornwells The Battle of France Then and Now is a book I have been after for a while unfortunately copies are going for over £45.00 on Amazon at the moment and dont often turn up on 2nd hand booksites.

Have you tried Abebooks? There are a couple for sale there at under US$40. I've used Abebooks a lot and never had a bad experience. I think it's a great shopfront for small booksellers trying to sell their stuff.

 

[fastmongrel]

I have looked at Abe books but last time I looked they had none in stock I will have a look again. Thanks for the heads up

 

[fastmongrel]

Just ordered a copy off Abebooks £29.50 delivered. Expensive but I hope worth it thanks buffnut

 

[FalkeEins]

Lionel Persyn in his summing in his huge 448-page book on the type says .." the H-75 was undoubtedly the plane of the French aces but it was also the plane of defeat. " Whereas of course the Hurricane ( in close collaboration with the Spitfire ) was the plane of victory...

Another sentence of Persyn's which sums up the H-75 pretty well "... it wasn't really a hunter, but when hunted it could bite back..."

incidentally, Cornwell exploits Persyn's book pretty heavily..but H-75 fans should opt for Lionel's " Curtiss Hawk H-75 in French service" published by MMP which is basically the best bits of the French book put into an English-language format..

 

[Juha2]

Yes, Lionel's " Curtiss Hawk H-75 in French service" is a good book even if most of the page space seems to have been used in photos. There is also plenty of colour profiles and two colour 4-views. The text is good. 144 pages.

 

[merlin]

A couple clips from the RAE Curtiss H-75 handling tests and comp aileron tests H-75, Spitfire and Gloster F.5/34 based on the RAE Report No BA 1583 AVIA 6/2338
View attachment 357171

Any more info there about the charachistics of the Gloster f.5/34? Surprised it thought visibility was better in the P-36, compared to the 'all-round' cockpit canopy of the Gloster!