Soviet aircraft the west coulda/shoulda used?

[Tzaw1]

even if the AM-35A and 38 engines had successivly passed the state 100 hours trials, they were soon reduced to 50 hours of TBO (time before overhall) for serial ones. It's also an explanation for the short life expectancy of the early Il-2's.

Yes, this is explanation for the short life expectancy, but in normal exploitation. Isn't explanation for damage ratio: 27% wings, 25% tail and tail rods, 20% rear hull, 10% landing gear, 8% propeller. Remaining 10% in my last post.

It seems that there were a 12mm plate protecting pilor's neck and head, and 5mm partition between the pilot's back and the main tank.

It seems, but was only for pilot's neck and head. Seat was not protected.
There was only thin wall between the pilot's back and the main tank. Non-armoured.
See attachments. Armoured plates are drawed with thick line.

 

[Altea]

Yes, this is explanation for the short life expectancy, but in normal exploitation. Isn't explanation for damage ratio: 27% wings, 25% tail and tail rods, 20% rear hull, 10% landing gear, 8% propeller. Remaining 10% in my last post.

It's an explanation for why nobody managed to restore a damaged Stormovik with 35-40 flight hours life. What for, working 600-1000 man hours for the reminding 10 -15 flight hours (if nothing would hapenagain)?And why was it systematically send to the "PARM front reparation mobile workshops" and written-off for combat damages there by technical comission, for spart-pieces.

It seems, but was only for pilot's neck and head. Seat was not protected.
There was only thin wall between the pilot's back and the main tank. Non-armoured.
See attachments. Armoured plates are drawed with thick line.

The thin wall as you called it, on pilot's back has 5mm armor thick in the TsK-55 (BSh-2.1): both for D section and E section

Increased to 7mm from the TsKB-57 (BSh-2.2 future Il-2). Some sources quoted 5mm but it is obviously an error taken on the first TsKB 55-57 projects. (The TsKB-57 was a TsKB-55 with a Mikouline 38 engine instead of the 35A one, and a 155 kg extra tank instead of the rear gunner).
So for the Il-2 and Il-2M-3: 7mm armor for D and 12mm thick for the E section wall.
Anyway there'is no doubt about the fact that the wall always existed. But maybe M. Perov and Rastrenin discovered someting new since 2003?

Regards

 

[FLYBOYJ]

It's an explanation for why nobody managed to restore a damaged Stormovik with 35-40 flight hours life. What for, working 600-1000 man hours for the reminding 10 -15 flight hours (if nothing would hapenagain)?And why was it systematically send to the "PARM front reparation mobile workshops" and written-off there by technical comission, for spart-pieces.

Actually in today's world a restoration would be possible (at least in the US) that could possibly raise the hours on a restored airframe or a new airframe (and engine) life could be established based on flying the aircraft in a civilian capacity (airshows).

 

[Altea]

Actually in today's world a restoration would be possible (at least in the US) that could possibly raise the hours on a restored airframe or a new airframe (and engine) life could be established based on flying the aircraft in a civilian capacity (airshows).

Maybe, but considering war statistics Il-2 ground crews were busy enough, since 50% of the Il2 came back with light or heavy damages to their airfields. You won't do miracles with an engine that is a kind of industrial wreckage. Last AM-38 were better and had a TBO of 150 hours. Boston Cyclone about 400 hours and even 600 for some special series.

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Maybe, but considering war statistics Il-2 ground crews were busy enough, since 50% of the Il2 came back with light or heavy damages to their airfields. You won't do miracles with an engine that is a kind of industrial wreckage. Last AM-38 were better and had a TBO of 150 hours. Boston Cyclone about 400 hours and even 600 for some special series.

Agree - If an IL-2 airframe was found today that could possibly be made airworthy, I think an Allison would be a first choice as a reliable substitute engine.

 

[Clay_Allison]

Agree - If an IL-2 airframe was found today that could possibly be made airworthy, I think an Allison would be a first choice as a reliable substitute engine.

I hope big CNC machines become available soon that can crank out new Allison blocks. we are running out of Allisons.

 

[GrauGeist]

So there aren't any AM-38 engines to be found anywhere?

If not, then why not remanufacturer a modern version?

 

[FLYBOYJ]

So there aren't any AM-38 engines to be found anywhere?

If not, then why not remanufacturer a modern version?

I think you'd have better chances with an Allison.

 

[GrauGeist]

Nothing against Allisons, I've always been partial to them.

I was just thinking from an authentic restoration point of view.

I'm sure the logistics of replicating a complete AM-38 would be a nightmare, mostly because of the lack of NOS parts needed to complete even a new one.

Probably the same reason why there's only one Zero with an original Sakae engine left

 

[FLYBOYJ]

Nothing against Allisons, I've always been partial to them.

I was just thinking from an authentic restoration point of view.

I'm sure the logistics of replicating a complete AM-38 would be a nightmare, mostly because of the lack of NOS parts needed to complete even a new one.

Probably the same reason why there's only one Zero with an original Sakae engine left

Yep!

 

[Clay_Allison]

I am rooting hard for automated manufacturing, someday it should get cheap enough for me to own my own Warbird replica for the cost of an expensive luxury car/motorhome.

 

[Altea]

So there aren't any AM-38 engines to be found anywhere?

If not, then why not remanufacturer a modern version?

The last ones are already in use


rusavia

 

[Colin1]

It seems, but was only for pilot's neck and head. Seat was not protected.
There was only thin wall between the pilot's back and the main tank. Non-armoured

How did the pilot strap himself in?

 

[GrauGeist]

How did the pilot strap himself in?

If it was me, they'd have to use handcuffs and a stright-jacket...

Noway in hell I would have flown one of those things into battle.

 

[alejandro_]

The only case about which I heard, it is considering about the purchase of the equipment in USSR in September 1939.

I read this comment in the first page. I was wondering which equipment the UK would consider for import in September 1939. Any information?

 

[Edgar Brooks]

None, since the USSR was also involved in the invasion, partition and destruction of Poland. That really would have been the ultimate betrayal.

 

[tomo pauk]

I read this comment in the first page. I was wondering which equipment the UK would consider for import in September 1939. Any information?

Don't think that Soviets have had anything to offer in 1939 that will equal, let alone better what the UK/RAF have had at the time.

 

[alejandro_]

Don't think that Soviets have had anything to offer in 1939 that will equal, let alone better what the UK/RAF have had at the time.

Of course, but these were times when European nations were getting as much armament as possible. If you are desperate, Il-16 are better than nothing.

I thought all interest vanished after Winter War.

 

[tomo pauk]

UK was, maybe, desperate to acquire more fighters in mid-1940, when France and some other Allied/friendly countries fell. In 1939, France was in a more desperate need, their best domestic fighter in 1939 being the MS-406?
Though, the P-36 should be a better aircraft than the I-16.

 

[Shortround6]

In 1939 and most of 1940 the UK was paying cash, both to domestic and foreign manufacturers.

Buying 2nd best if you need numbers is one thing, buying crap and not having enough moneyleft to pay for good stuff is something else.

And the desperation factor changed considerably from the Fall of 1939, to the spring of 1940 to the late summer/fall of 1940 to the winter of 1940/41. Greatest desperation being just after France fell. BY Nov/Dec of 1940 the German "invasion" had been pushed back from weeks away to months away (Spring/summer of 1941) British domestic production was ramping up, more time could be spent assessing some of the 'stuff' that was arriving from the US. If P-40B/C were being judged unfit for European use, why buy I-16s?

Lagg-s and Yaks and many other Russian aircraft that fought in WW II were little more than prototypes in 1939/40.