Which other countries had "suicidal" aircrew in WW2?

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I have some docs i will put up when i am back home.

...but unlikely to be able to do so.

Most likely, hence why the command did not use the Fi 103R. They considered it a waste of human recourses.

Even the SonderKommando Elbe was only used once.

German culture is not like the Japanese one. You were not going to find swarms of German pilots seeking an honorable death by suicide.

 

[MiTasol]

You are mixing two definitions of "suicidal" and so are inviting a wide range of responses. There is a big difference between accepting CERTAIN death as in the case of the Kamikaze pilots and pushing safety envelopes as in the case of removing armour.

Deliberately to invite as wide a discussion as possible - and at Midway the crews knew they had insufficient fuel to return to base so would have to ditch and hope for retrieval which is far more risky than removing armour.

 

[MiTasol]

I would not classify these Australian pilots/crews or the American pilots as suicidal. They are accepting certain risks to accomplish a mission, but their mission was not to die to accomplish the mission.

The same could be said of the Japanese pilots who believed that increased maneuverability was better protection and increased their chances of beating their opponent.

 

[MiTasol]

Well my two favorite "against the odds" were posted. I wish I could remember the Polish destroyers that seemed determined as well. There was a Merchant Marine freighter that counter attacked an IJN merchant cruiser. I think that may have been "pissed-off" big time rather than suicidal.
It was a YouTube vid on "History Deserves To Be Remembered ". I can't remember the names. Senility isn't as fun as I thought it would be.

yeh. Oldtimers disease is better than the alternative tho

 

[pbehn]

One of the first operations of B-26 bombers lost all A/C but that wasnt the fault of the aircrew, but poor planning tactics of those that decided on the mission. During the BoB many pilots were lost chasing LW fighters or bombers across the Channel despite orders not to do so. Young men underestimate danger and overestimate their abilities (ask an insurance company). Chasing a plane across the Pas de Calais was reckless to the point of stupidity, they were flying into the biggest concentration of LW fighters anywhere in Europe and when they broke off they had to make their way back through LW planes returning to base. If you keep taking that risk you will eventually lose, which is what happened, but until they lost they considered they were good at it.

 

[The Basket]

There was a Liberty ship that fought back against two German surface raiders in the South Atlantic, I beleive the skipper actually turned into them to bring the fight.
Don't recall names (I think one raider was the Stier?), the Liberty ship being sunk but not before damaging the Stier and setting it on fire.

To my knowledge it was Stier and a blockade runner. So only one German combat ship.

The two ships got very close due to fog.

I wouldn't say it was suicidal although it was certainly mutually destructive.

 

[GrauGeist]

To my knowledge it was Stier and a blockade runner. So only one German combat ship.

The two ships got very close due to fog.

I wouldn't say it was suicidal although it was certainly mutually destructive.

I was going by memory, having read the story decades ago, so I did a bit of searching and found it:

DKM Stier (HSK6/Schiff 23)
Armament:
6) 15cm guns
1) 75mm gun
1) twin-mount 3.7cm gun
4) 2cm guns
2) 21" torpedo tubes

MS Tannenfels
Armament:
1) 15cm gun
?) 3.7cm guns
?) 2cm guns

SS Stephen Hopkins
Armament:
1) 4" (102mm) gun
2) 3.7cm guns
6) .50 Mgs

On the morning of 27 September 1942, the Stier, accompanied by Tannenfels attempted to halt the Hopkins at 8:55 a.m. and the Hopkins came about and attacked both the Stier and Tannenfels.
The combined fire from Stier and Tannenfels overwhelmed the Hopkins, but not before damaging the Tannenfels and inflicting severe damage to the Stier, which eventually sank an hour and fourty minutes after the battle.
The Stephen Hopkins is the only merchant ship to have sunk a German surface ship during the war.

 

[The Basket]

Did the blockade runner fire on the Stephen Hopkins?

My memory is as riddled with holes as the Yamato.

 

[GrauGeist]

Did the blockade runner fire on the Stephen Hopkins?

My memory is as riddled with holes as the Yamato.

Yes, the MS Tannenfels assisted the Stier after the Hopkins attacked, suffering light damage during the melee.

 

[glennasher]

I think the closest to "suicidal" I can think of, is the destroyer escorts and destroyers of the US Navy in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. In my estimation. every one of those sailors deserves a Navy Cross. They attacked the Japanese Central Force knowing that they couldn't sink a cruiser or battleship once they ran out of torpedoes, yet they attacked time and again.

 

[33k in the air]

My memory is as riddled with holes as the Yamato.

You can take heart from the fact that Yamato was eventually turned into an excellent space battleship which defeated both the Gamilons and the Comet Empire!

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Considering that the OP's definition of "suicidal" regarded stripping of gear meant to protect the craft, and also that many others chiming in are thinking in terms of a suicide mission no matter the gear, I'm cutting the baby in half and saying HMS Campbeltown in its raid on St Nazaire. Sailing in a ship stripped of much useful gear, those Commandos knew going in that they'd have to find their way back to different bottoms to get home safely.

Many didn't. It was suicidal either way you cut the cake.

 

[swampyankee]

While they certainly weren't aircrew, one wonders if one should include the Rangers at the Pointe du Hoc. One day, when I was substitute teaching, a teacher brought in her grandfather, who was with the Rangers there, to talk to the students (they were in 3rd grade). While the kids could tell the memories were still making him very sad, I don't think they could understand (nor can I) just how horrible that day was, just that it brought tears to an old man over sixty-five years after the events.

 

[The Basket]

You can take heart from the fact that Yamato was eventually turned into an excellent space battleship which defeated both the Gamilons and the Comet Empire!

I have literally no idea what you're talking about.

I find it most disturbing that no one has mentioned eating field rations or eating in the mess.

Take your life in your hands.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I find it most disturbing that no one has mentioned eating field rations or eating in the mess.

Take your life in your hands.

 

[glennasher]

I have literally no idea what you're talking about.

I find it most disturbing that no one has mentioned eating field rations or eating in the mess.

Take your life in your hands.

I think it's a Star Trek reference, but I wouldn't bet money on it.

 

[SaparotRob]

I think it's a Star Trek reference, but I wouldn't bet money on it.

You would have lost.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I think it's a Star Trek reference, but I wouldn't bet money on it.

Space Battleship Yamato

Space Battleship Yamato - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[33k in the air]

I find it most disturbing that no one has mentioned eating field rations or eating in the mess.

In the words of the inimitable Bugs Bunny, if it's the Captain's mess, let him clean it up!

 

[ThomasP]

Would pilots that intentionally rammed enemy aircraft count as suicidal?