buffnut453
Captain
So you know better than the guy who was there and who was a credited ace to boot?
I'm lost for words.
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And Wagner's assessment was after only the first week of combat. If the P-39s were lighter and could get above the Zeros he wouldn't have needed any extra engine armor.
Four .30calMGs with two synchronized is not much armament for a modern fighter.
I was assuming the ammo load weight for both the .30s and .50s was approximately the same.
Ivan,
I wasn't the one pushing that idea, in fact I find it vaguely ridiculous. Other forum members were suggesting that American youth grew up with an inmate ability to resolve mechanical problems because every farmer had a beat-up Model T. It's an attempt to demonstrate American exceptionalism compared to other nations in an area where, frankly, it didn't exist.
Visualize Koga's approach. He's touching down in tall grass with an unknown surface below. Because of his flat viewing angle, he's not going to catch the gleam of the water below. The slowest, softest touchdown with a taildragger is accomplished with an exaggerated three point landing, likely tailwheel first, and the engine ticking over a little above idle to aid in controllability. This was a one shot attempt, as his engine was practically out of oil and not likely to survive a go around.
As his tailwheel starts to drag in the tundra, the mains splash down, dig in hard, and flip the plane violently ass over teakettle onto its prop spinner then onto its back, capturing one prop blade underneath and sudden-stopping the engine. The main gear struts probably didn't come completely unglued until after the somersault impetus was well underway. I remember reading that one of the recovery party remarked that the landing gear struts were lying in rather odd locations, given the imagined gyrations of the aircraft.
Take a model of a Zero or other low wing taildragger and "hand fly" it through a couple table top three point landings, noting the angles at which the landing gears contact the surface. I think it will become self evident.
Back to P39s. Do I detect the sickly aroma of an expired equine carcass? My toes are bruised and bleeding; how about yours?
In the words of forensic pathologists, "blunt force trauma". Once it stubbed its toe in the tundra, it would have bashed its nose in the mud as it flipped onto its back.Note the extensive damage to cowl and forward fuselage ahead of cockpit.
Then how do you account for the need to straighten twelve connecting rods? On a radial with that much rotating mass that's generally indicative of a sudden stop. The master rod in each cylinder row is massive and generally doesn't bend. Have you ever been inside one of these beasts?I don't believe the engine was turning any more when he touched down.
If the P-39s were lighter and could get above the Zeros he wouldn't have needed any extra engine armor.
I'm not claiming American technology was innately superior, certainly not to British or German, where we were a distant third or perhaps not on the podium at all, nor was I claiming tractor tinkerers would make instant aircraft maintenance technicians.Hello buffnut453,
I am not saying that the idea doesn't have SOME merit. What I am saying is that having experience working on tractors and cars and farm equipment in general may not necessarily translate to aeroplanes. Also, given the same opportunities, some people actually figure out what they are doing and some don't, but if more people are given the opportunity and necessity to experiment, some are bound to learn.
Are you arguing that less weight doesn't improve climb and ceiling?So you know better than the guy who was there and who was a credited ace to boot?
I'm lost for words.
Are you arguing that less weight doesn't improve climb and ceiling?
Wagner had a little experience in the Philippines but his pilots had literally no combat experience and the vast majority were just out of flying school.
In the words of forensic pathologists, "blunt force trauma". Once it stubbed its toe in the tundra, it would have bashed its nose in the mud as it flipped onto its back.
Then how do you account for the need to straighten twelve connecting rods? On a radial with that much rotating mass that's generally indicative of a sudden stop. The master rod in each cylinder row is massive and generally doesn't bend. Have you ever been inside one of these beasts?
Single engine planes generally don't have full feathering propellers, so even if the engine had quit running or was shut down it would still be windmilling. The bearings showed overheating but not seizure. Stopping a windmilling prop in flight requires holding the plane right on the edge of a stall for an extended period while engine compression slowly overcomes the aerodynamic windmilling effect, and is unachievable in some planes. A stationary prop significantly improves glide ratio, but is only useful when there's enough altitude to compensate for the loss due to the high sink rate while trying to get the prop stopped.
I'm not claiming American technology was innately superior, certainly not to British or German, where we were a distant third or perhaps not on the podium at all, nor was I claiming tractor tinkerers would make instant aircraft maintenance technicians.
What I was saying is that given the size of our population and the degree of mechanical penetration of our society, we could summon a greater cumulative mass of hands-on knuckle- busting, greasy hands, and behind-the-wheel experience than any other nation on earth. Though I dislike the term "American Exceptionalism", if that is what it is, so be it.
MEA CULPA, MEA MAXIMA CULPA! My apologies. I rechecked the repair list, and you're right, it was pushrods, not conrods. Disregard all my previous conjecture about sudden stops. You're probably also correct about the increasing internal friction likely bringing the prop to a stop during the flare to landing. Large aircooled engines have their piston rings riding on a thicker oil film on the cylinder walls than the more temperature-stable liquid cooled variety. That's why they consume so much oil, and why the internal friction rises more rapidly with oil depletion. No "STP to the rescue" here.There were no bent connecting rods in the repair list I have. There were 9 bent push rods.
The only logical explanation is that the people on the spot in PNG and Guadalcanal thought that the "extra weight" of wing 30 cals and armour plate was NECESSARY and not "useless."
Crow tastes awful! Even barbecued! Even Cajun style!
From personal experience I can tell you NO.Doesn't it just taste like chicken?
More like "bean porridge in the pot, nine days old"! Eye of newt and toe of frog for garnish.Doesn't it just taste like chicken?
That's how mom made it.More like "bean porridge in the pot, nine days old"! Eye of newt and toe of frog for garnish.