3 Blade Hamilton Standard Propeller

[sgtleehead]

Can anyone tell me if the 3 blade Hamilton Standard Propeller fitted to the Corsair was the same as that fitted to the Hellcat and even the Grumman Avenger or the Curtis Helldiver SB2C. Was it the same model or similar in each case?

I know the size quoted - approx 13.1 to 13.2 is similarly quoted for the Corsair and Hellcat. I cannot seem to find more in depth reference material in regard to this company and its products circa WW2

Thanks for any replies.


Lee

 

[Airframes]

Like you, I haven't found a definitive answer, but, from looking at the specs for the prop on each of the aircraft mentioned, I think it very likely that they were the same prop, or very similar - perhaps with slightly different pitch requirements.
I do seem to recall reading somewhere, that the prop on the Corsair and, I think Avenger and Hellcat were the same, but, with these aircraft and their operational theatres not being my strong point, I can't state it as fact.
It's probable that someone here will have the answer though.

 

[swampyankee]

Try to contact the people at the New England Air Museum. UTC Aerospace Systems (formerly Hamilton Standard) is just a couple of miles away, and numerous HSD/UTAS retirees work or volunteer there. They may have the answer, or may know who to ping for the right answer.

 

[GregP]

Well let's see.

The propeller for a Grumman F6F-3 Hellcat is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 1 inch, propeller designation ????. Pitch went from 26° to 65°.

The propeller for a Grumman F6F-5 Hellcat is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 1 inch, propeller designation 6501A-0.

The propeller for a Vought F4U-1 Corsair is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet, 3 inches, propeller designation 6443A-21.

The propeller for a Vought F4U-4 Corsair is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 4-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 2 inches, propeller designation 6501A-0.

I can't find the propeller designation for the F6F-3 just now, but the Planes of Fame has all the manuals and I can check this weekend. Interesting the F4U-4 with a 4-blade prop has the same propeller designation as the F6F-5 with a 3-bladed prop. Likely as not the designation means the two have the same propeller airfoil with slightly different diameters. Again, I can check this weekend … assuming one of the chief pilots is there and not off at airshows … they all were last weekend.


- Greg

 

[sgtleehead]

That's all appreciated, thanks in advance,

Lee

 

[Hueyman]

Hello,

Sorry to up this topic so late, but just for clarification :

A constant speed variable pitch propeller is a comibination of blades and Hub, and are so designated as such. There is not a single designation number for the whole propeller, but one for blades and another for the hub.

6507A is the designation of the blade itself, ( shape, chord, lenght, airfoil, shank design etc ... ) and for example the minus ( 6507A-1 ) means the lenght, in inches, that was sanded on blade tip to make it suitable for each type of aircraft and engine application. For instance, a B-17F blade is a 6477A-0, where it has it's original lenght, no lenght reduction.

Then comes the Hub designation number. Simply, 23E50 is the three bladed hub ( DC-3, B-17, B-24, F4U-1, F6F etc ... ) and 24E60 the four bladed one ( F4U-4, P-47 ... )

So such a prop is designated :

F4U-1D Prop : 23E50/6507A-0(x3) : That describe the three bladed Hamilton Standard Propeller for the Corsair

Hope that helps !

Hueyman

 

[GregP]

Never did find out any more data. The part number are as stated and we have F6F-5 manuals, not F6F-3.

 

[Shortround6]

A basic explanation of Hamilton Standard prop hub code goes like this.

23E50

2 is the basic model number/size.

3 is the number of blades

E is the blade shank size

50 is the propshaft shank size.

a code for the prop blade goes something like this.

A-7027C-A -8

A - (If used) indicates shank fairing design.

7027- Aerodynamic and structural features.

C- Operational features (may indicate particular deicing assembly), does
not affect eligibility.

8- Nominal reduction from basic diameter in inches.

Obviously the hub designation alone doesn't help a whole lot and it may be quite possible to fit a prop (or the blades) from one plane to another if the blade tips are trimmed to adjust exact diameter. I have no idea what the max allowable "trim" is. This may also be a repair for minor tip damage so propeller diameters might be regarded as "nominal" rather than exact. What was done in a combat setting may be very different from what the FAA allows for civilian flying.

 

[Hueyman]

Yup, thanks for detailing even further.

Still we don't have the final answer, and comparing nowadays blades on both planes doesn't mean
anything as many were suitanle but not originally designed for ( ex of current Yaks with Hamilton Std props )

 

[GregP]

Most of the current new-build Yaks have Allison engines and cut-down DC-3 props.

 

[GrauGeist]

Never did find out any more data. The part number are as stated and we have F6F-5 manuals, not F6F-3.

F6F-3 has a Hamilton Standard 23E50

 

[Hueyman]

Most of the current new-build Yaks have Allison engines and cut-down DC-3 props.

What's the point of this repetition ?

F6F-3 has a Hamilton Standard 23E50

No, if you took the time to read just above messages from Shortround and myself, you'd see 23E50 means nothing but the hub design.

To reply the original poster : Your answer is in F6F-3/-5 PoH, you probably can download PDF for a low cost on Avialog.

Usually, propeller characteristics ( dimensions, hub/blade design, pitch settings ... ) are located on the " Aircraft description ", sub-category " Powerplant " of the Pilot Operating Handbook.

Cheers,
Hueyman

 

[DarrenW]

Hello,

I realize that this is an older thread but I was able to find information regarding the Hamilton-Standard propeller blade design used on the F6F-3 Hellcat. According to a document titled Production Inspection Trials (TED NO. BIS 2116) on MODEL F6F-3 AIRPLANE NO. 25892 held 1 June 1943 to 17 September 1944, the aircraft had a blade design of No. 6501A-0, which is identical to what was used on the F6F-5. There are several other flight test documents from the same time period concerning other F6F-3s that also used this same blade design.

 

[GregP]

Simple clarification, if you just must know.

A Hamilton-Standard went on MANY aircraft, and a DC-3/C-47 prop is one of several specific types of H-S.

Mox nix to me.

 

[Yabo]

Well let's see.

The propeller for a Grumman F6F-3 Hellcat is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 1 inch, propeller designation ????. Pitch went from 26° to 65°.

The propeller for a Grumman F6F-5 Hellcat is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 1 inch, propeller designation 6501A-0.

The propeller for a Vought F4U-1 Corsair is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 3-blade with a diameter of 13 feet, 3 inches, propeller designation 6443A-21.

The propeller for a Vought F4U-4 Corsair is shown to be a Hamilton-Standard 4-blade with a diameter of 13 feet 2 inches, propeller designation 6501A-0.

I can't find the propeller designation for the F6F-3 just now, but the Planes of Fame has all the manuals and I can check this weekend. Interesting the F4U-4 with a 4-blade prop has the same propeller designation as the F6F-5 with a 3-bladed prop. Likely as not the designation means the two have the same propeller airfoil with slightly different diameters. Again, I can check this weekend … assuming one of the chief pilots is there and not off at airshows … they all were last weekend.


- Greg

I am trying to design propellers for my models, balsa versions. I usually carve them by eye from pictures, not knowing if I am even close to the actual thing. I want to model them using SolidWorks then 3D print them. I am looking for cross section drawings for the Corsair F4U-4.