Well, someone who knows everything but has no answers obviously would. I am done here..
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Well, someone who knows everything but has no answers obviously would. I am done here..I just know many different facts, moreover I can analyze them - as distinct from you, Cap.
Fleetwings built the BT-12 Sophomore stainless-steel trainer.Seems like in some places, or at least in Germany, such aircraft were considered.
link
Perhaps someone can chime in wrt. this suggestion, and viability of steel aircraft in general?
Mea culpa. Didn't read my file browser carefully enough. The Design Analysis was in the October, 1943, issue of Aviation.Fleetwings built the BT-12 Sophomore stainless-steel trainer.
Acquired by Kaiser in 1943. Eaton records show 24 delivered.
Aviation magazine did one of their Design Analysis articles on the BT-12 in June, 1942.
Aviation magazines are available at the Internet Archive.
Framework Yes. But this question asks which aircraft have been made predominantly from steel,"/ i.e skin too, preferably monocoque or semi-monocoque.Much of the Hawker Hurricane's fuselage framework was made of steel, wasn't it?
NO! Stop spreading BSAs was the Typhoon and Tempest.
YES! Look at the cockpit sections.NO! Stop spreading BS
Stainless steel seems like a great material for seaplanes but I wonder how the spotwelds held up against corrosion. Unfortunately, the Fleetwings fleet size isn't big enough to give us much service data.Fleetwings Sea Bird was all stainless....
I've been watching the restoration of the Il-2 in NASM's shop, and a lot of the forward fuselage is still, mostly as armor plate protection.
You can, as many post show, make planes out of steel.Perhaps someone can chime in wrt. this suggestion, and viability of steel aircraft in general?
That car is bitchin'!You can, as many post show, make planes out of steel.
Wither they should is another question.
There were a number of reasons to try.
Mostly related to material shortages. The Fleetwing was from 1934-35 and even all metal aluminum planes were not common or only a few years old.
Corrosion coatings/treatments were in their infancy so Stainless steel may have been seen as alternative in regards to maintenance.
Steel companies were also pushing stainless steel for all sorts of products.
View attachment 758497
I got a short ride in one of these back around 1970. A friend's father (Ex- Corsair pilot) was an executive in a local steel company got access to it and a newer one for for a local celebration parade.
For aircraft the question was also if steel made the plane lighter or heavier and if heavier, what did it do for the designer that made up for the weight.
The IL-2 offered protection. It also cost payload (bombs, guns, fuel) or performance.
IL-2 had over 70% more power than Fairey Battle, wasn't much faster, flew 1/2 as far. only carried about 30% more bombs. A lot of trade-offs.
Using the steel armor was an attempt to save weight as the armor doubled as structural weight, instead of adding armor to an existing structure.
I doubt there is any use of pure aluminium in anything other than a heat sink. The currently machinable 6061-T6 contains silicone and magnesium. The 5052-H32 used for sheet metal, contains magnesium. The aircraft structural grades are 2024-T4 and 7075-T6, and they contain copper, and zinc respectively. Duralumin is very similar to the 2000 grade alloys. They all primarily are aluminium. All densities are around 2700kg/m^3 (0.1lb/in^3) and all have elastic modulii of around 70GPA (10Mpsi). The alloys affect corrosion resistance, work hardenability and heat treatability, and ultimately, the strength.WW2 aircraft were generally not made from Aluminium but from Duralumin an alloy developed in Germany from 1909, it is an alloy of mainly Aluminium Copper Magnesium and Manganese. From an article/study posted here the alloys used by the USA and Germany were almost identical, British differed slightly
Please name a steel alloy that is 50% stuff other than iron.Nope. Steel can contain 50% alloying additives, i.e. elements other than iron. Please use correct analogies.
PS. I could tell you a lot about aluminum alloys and their characterization (including elemental analysis). You may not believe me, but sometimes an opponent can have a pretty decent background in materials science.
Seems like in some places, or at least in Germany, such aircraft were considered.
link
Perhaps someone can chime in wrt. this suggestion, and viability of steel aircraft in general?
This is slightly complicated. Steel has three times the elastic modulus of aluminium and three times the density. If we build a truss structure in which the pieces all are loaded in tension and compression, there is no structural difference between steel and aluminium. Cost and ease of fabrication will be very important. If you make a cantilevered structure with some weight limit, the conforming aluminium structural section will bigger, stiffer and stronger.Stainless steel MiG-25s aside, steel is heavier than aluminium.
Why has aluminium, rather than steel, prevailed in airliner construction?
As any cyclist knows, steel has many advantages over aluminium: it's stronger (for the same size) it can handle greater forces without needing to be stiffer it has better fatigue characteristics i...aviation.stackexchange.com
Also, steel is an alloy needing further working, while AIUI aluminum is mined and faster to get onto aircraft. Here in Canada, aluminum is readily available.
HiThis is slightly complicated. Steel has three times the elastic modulus of aluminium and three times the density. If we build a truss structure in which the pieces all are loaded in tension and compression, there is no structural difference between steel and aluminium. Cost and ease of fabrication will be very important. If you make a cantilevered structure with some weight limit, the conforming aluminium structural section will bigger, stiffer and stronger.
Structures usually fail in compression by buckling, so a fatter aluminium section may have an advantage in certain truss structural elements.
I am grossly simplifying things here.
We should distinguish between entirely steel structures such as the J2 I noted above, and composite structures containing steel. Steel is an excellent material for making tubular trusses on many aircraft including Hurricanes, but ultimately, they are covered in fabric. The Hurricane's rounded fuselage shape was due to wooden formers and stringers.
On the Hawker Typhoon and Tempest, the forward fuselage was steel tube covered by removeable aluminium panels. The rear part was aluminium monocoque.
Please name a steel alloy that is 50% stuff other than iron.
| Nickel | 34.00-37% |
| Chromium | 18.00-22.00% |
| Carbon | 0.08% Max |
| Silicon | 1.00 – 1.50% |
| Manganese | 2.00 Max% |
| Phosphorus | 0.03 Max% |
| Sulfur | 0.03 Max% |
| Copper | 1.00 Max% |
| Iron | Balance |
| Alloy | % Content | ||
| Ni | Cr | Fe | |
| NiCr 80/20 | 80 | 20 | 0 |
| NiCr 70/30 | 70 | 30 | 0 |
| NiCr 60/16 | 60 | 16 | Balance |
| NiCr 35/20 | 35 | 20 | Balance |