Aircraft-Technological Firsts

[marshall]

First RAF aircraft (and first allied aircraft) to exceed 500 mph in level flight.

What about the XP-47J, 507mph during tests, wouldn't it be the first allied aircraft?

 

[kool kitty89]

The Vampire flew in September 1943, the XP-47J in November. (the XP-47J was the first piston engined plane to exceed 500 mph) Republic XP-47J Thunderbolt

Soren, I said the first single engine fighter design to be built and to fly, it didn't enter service until 2 years after it (spider crab) flew. (I never said it was the first in combat, in fact the 2 YP-80's in Italy were the only single engine Allied jets to perform any operations during the war)


Wasn't the Ar 234 performing recon before the 262 began operations? (other than training)

the remainder were all Jumo 004 powered, with the V7 prototype destined to make history on August 2, 1944 as the first jet aircraft ever to fly a reconnaissance mission.

In April 1944, Erprobungskommando 262 was formed at Lechfeld in Bavaria as a test unit to introduce the 262 into service and train a core of pilots to fly it. Major Walter Nowotny was assigned as commander in July 1944, and the unit redesignated Kommando Nowotny. Essentially a trials and development unit, it holds the distinction of having mounted the world's first jet fighter operations. Trials continued slowly with initial operational missions against the Allies in August 1944, allegedly downing 19 Allied aircraft for six Me 262s lost, although these claims have never been verified by cross-checking with USAAF records. The RAF Museum holds no intelligence reports of RAF aircraft engaging in combat with an Me 262 in August 1944, although there is a report of an unarmed encounter between an Me 262 and a Mosquito.[10] Despite orders to stay grounded Nowotny chose to fly a mission against an enemy formation. After an engine failure he was shot down and killed on 8 November 1944 by 1st Lt Edward "Buddy" Haydon of the 357th Fighter Group, USAAF and Capt Ernest "Feeb" Fiebelkorn of the 20th Fighter Group, USAAF. The "Kommando" was then withdrawn for further training and a revision of combat tactics to optimise the 262's strengths.

By January 1945, Jagdgeschwader 7 (JG 7) had been formed as a pure jet fighter unit, although it would be several weeks before it was operational.

The Me 262 was the first production jet fighter and the first fully combat capable jet fighter. (the Meteor I was not) And the first jet to begin preliminary operations. (non-combat trials and training)

And the Meteor was the first in regular squadron service:

No. 616 Squadron RAF was the first to receive operational Meteors, 14 of them. The squadron was based at RAF Culmhead, Somerset and was previously equipped with the Spitfire VII. After a short conversion course at Farnborough for the six leading pilots, the first aircraft were delivered in July [1]. The squadron was soon moved to RAF Manston on the east Kent coast and, within a week, 30 pilots were deemed successfully converted.

The RAF initially reserved the aircraft to counter the V-1 flying bomb threat with No.616's Meteors seeing action for the first time on 27 July 1944 with three aircraft active over Kent. After some initial problems, especially with jamming guns, the first two V1 "kills" occurred on 4 August. In total, the Meteor accounted for 14 flying bombs. The anti-V1 missions of 27 July 1944 were the Meteor's (and the Royal Air Force's) first operational jet combat missions.

Also was the Meteor III was the first jet fighter to fly in combat over enemy territory, in early '45? (it could be the 262, but did the Me 262 ever do so? over russia maybe)

 

[marshall]

The Vampire flew in September 1943, the XP-47J in November. (the XP-47J was the first piston engined plane to exceed 500 mph) Republic XP-47J Thunderbolt

Thanks for that, don't know why but I thought that Vampire couldn't flew in 1943.

 

[Soren]

KK,

A prototype Ar-234 performed one recon operation in August 1944, but the Ar-234B didn't see official service until September 44 (Although prototypes were carrying out operations in June July IIRC). But the Me-262A-1a already entered service in April 44.

As for the Vampire being the first single engined Jet fighter design to fly, well that's indeed true

 

[kool kitty89]

Yep just ~6 months after the Meteor, due to the horrible Rover/Power-Jets team-up that cost the British jet program ~2 years. (and ongoing problems with Rover resulted in the Meteor first flying on early 1,500 lbf Halford engines)

The fifth prototype, DG206, powered by two de Havilland Halford H.1 engines due to problems with the intended Whittle W.2 engines, was the first to become airborne on 5 March 1943 from RAF Cranwell, piloted by Michael Daunt[1] Development then moved to Newmarket Heath and, later, a Gloster-owned site at Moreton Valence. The first Whittle-engined aircraft, DG205/G, flew on 17 June 1943

 

[Soren]

The Me-262 was the first Jet fighter to enter service, but the Meteor was the first to see action in the way that it intercepted V-1's. The Me-262 however was the first Jet fighter to encounter and combat enemy a/c, and the He-162 was the first single engined jet fighter to do the same.

The Me-262 was also the first Jet-powered nightfighter, a couple of Ar-234's seeing service as such a little later.

 

[wingnuts]

First purposely built Jet trainer, Fokker S.14:

I think the second (?) purpose built 2 seat jet trainer was the Fouga Magister, a lot more successul and still in use by the Israele Defence Forces although rebuilt and much modified as the IAI Zukit, the IDF also used it in the ground attack role.

the fouga magister in israeli service

"You don't get into a Magister.... you put it on!"

 

[pbfoot]

The first aircraft with variable pitch propellor

 

[Soren]

And it's invisible as-well ??! Awesome stealth technology, wish we had that today!

 

[kool kitty89]

The first aircraft with variable pitch propellor

Is what?


And Soren,
(see my quotes 2 posts ago)
And soren the Me 262 started operational traials and training with Erprobungskommando 262 in april of '44, they first saw action in August. (which may or may not have been before the Ar 234 V-7 on Aug 2nd)
In January of '45 Jagdgeschwader 7 (JG 7) had been formed as a pure jet fighter unit.
However the Meteor entered squadron service with No. 616 Squadron deleviered in July of '44 and converted in a week 30 pilots had been converted.
They first faw action in July 27 '44. (before the Me 262 did in August).


And you could call the first Meteor kill of a V-1 the first jet vs. jet "kill". Both being jet powered. The first Jet aircraft to shoot down another Jet powered aircraft. (depenting on definition of "aircraft," and a pulse jet is still a jet engine, using combustion gasses to produce thrust)

Of course the Me 262 was the first to shoot down an actual piloted combat aircraft. And the first fully combat capable jet fighter in service. (I'd count the Meteor III with long nacelles and the He 162 as the only other 2 to acheive this; the Vampire was a more capable design than the Meteor but the air ministry stayed focused on the Meteor and DH was concentrating on Mossies, the Firs production Vampire Mk.I flew in April '45 but only a handfull were built before the war's end and didn't enter service until after)



But which was the first jet fighter (not for recon) to venture over enemy territory?

 

[Soren]

The V-1 is not an aircraft, it's a selfguided ballistic missile.

And yes the Meteor did see action before the Me-262, but the Me-262 entered service first and was also the first to see action against actual enemy a/c, and the He-162 was the first single engined jet to do the same.

As for the first jet to venture over enemy territory, again it's the Me-262 as it flew over occupied France, Belgium, Holland and Soviet Union.

 

[Soren]

Is what?

Exactly

 

[kool kitty89]

Ok, I thoought the Me 262 was probably the first. (how else would the offensive ground attack units operate)


And Soren I was (mostly) joking on the V-1 "kills" thing, but the V-1 wasn't a ballistic missile, it was a cruise missile (a hell of alot closer to a true "aircraft" than a ballistic missile, and in the simplest definition the V-1 would fit aircraft - Definitions from Dictionary.com) the V-2 was a ballistic missile for sure.

 

[Soren]

The V-1 was a selfguided missile(Cruise or ballistic), not an aircraft. Some call it a flying bomb as it was litterally a bomb with an engine and small wings on it. Anyhow you got the point..

As for the only jet to reach beyond the once German invaded lands, it's the Ar-234 which flew recon over England.

 

[kool kitty89]

I said first jet fighter, I assumed a recon Jet had done this first. (wasn't sure if it was the Ar 234, or a recon Me 262)

Was it the Ar 234 V7?




I know the V-1 isn't an aircraft in terms of a comprehensive definition, another term used for development of such designs was "aerial torpedo." The definition can blured though, like with unmanned "aircraft" which may not be considdered aircraft, but the Manned version of the V-1 "Reichenberg" and the Ohka are certainly both aircraft. (even though the're both "flying bombs" as well)
(and a ballistic missile is one that follows a ballistic trajectories and don't rely on aerodynamic lift to reach their targets, making them inherantly diffrent from cruise missiles)


Speaking of which...

The first millitary UAV/Cruise missile/ "aerial torpedo"

Hewitt-Sperry Automatic Airplane - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And shortly after (developed at almost the same time) Kettering Bug - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And of course the V-1, the first example resembling anything close to a modern cruise missile. And the first example with practical usage capabilities.

 

[Soren]

Has the Wasserfall been mentioned yet?

The Wasserfall was the first selfguided surface to air missile.

 

[steven_wh]

Meteor:

First jet with pressurised cockpit

First jet to be flown with four distinct kinds of engines within the space of 2 years.
Axial flow jet - Metro-Vick 1943 (9 axial, 2 turbine, cannular combustor)
Single sided centrifugal jet - 1943 DH Goblin
Double sided centrifugals - Whittle/RR 1943, 1944
Turboprop - RR 1945

Steven

 

[red admiral]

The Wasserfall was the first selfguided surface to air missile.

Its not self-guided as it uses radio transmissions from the ground to control it for which it wasn't first. The UK had beam riding and semi-active homing missiles from 1942/3. Admittedly they didn't work too well, but neither did Wasserfall.

 

[Velius]

The first aircraft with variable pitch propellor

Now that he mentioned it, what was the first aircraft to use an adjustable pitch prop? Hydromatic?

 

[Graeme]

Now that he mentioned it, what was the first aircraft to use an adjustable pitch prop? Hydromatic?

I've got the R.E.8. It was fitted with a 4-blade variable pitch propeller at the Royal Aircraft Factory, Farnborough, in 1916.