B-24J Ford Conversion

Discussion in 'Building Questions, Tutorials and Guidebooks' started by Trebor, Sep 18, 2013.

  1. Trebor

    Trebor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,418
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    KCLS
    hey fellas, I need some help.

    I've come to find out that my Great Uncle's B-24J was built by the Ford Motor Company. they built their B-24's slightly differently. and the only difference is in the nose. Now, I've found a Ford resin replacement nose for the 1/48 Monogram kit. but since the kit has raised panel lines, and the resin nose doesn't, it'll be a bit of a challenge. is there any way I can reshape the nose to fit the Ford Built B-24's?
     
  2. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,757
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
    To be honst the Ford made B-24Js had the different turrets mounted only. The nose shape is almost the same like these mode by Consolidated factory. The difference is in bigger windows at the navigator's compartment. Also the bottom glass of the bombardier's station was of a slightly different layout. Just find a correct drawings in scale and compare the fuselage halves to them. And you will see. The correction is quite easy to make.
     
  3. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    9,728
    Likes Received:
    194
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Bridge & Highway Construction Inspector
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    #3 T Bolt, Sep 18, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2013
    Ford used a "kit" turret nose that slipped over what was basically a B-24D nose (with out the greenhouse framing) that looked quite different than the other manufacturers where the turret mount was more of less just bolted on to the front. Ford supplied the nose kit to other manufactures that used them in H models but I don't know if any were used in J models. All the ford build 24s used the Emerson electric turret as did most of the other manufactures J's only some of the early non Ford J's used the Consolidated A-2 or A-3 Hydraulic tail turret in the nose.

    I recently converted a J type nose to a Ford type in the 1/72nd Academy kit and it wasn't too difficult. the bombardiers window didn't go back quite far enough though but it's hardly noticeable. Yo can see it here starting at post #192 http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/18-heavy-hitters-ii/done-1-72-b-24h-booby-trap-heavy-hitters-ii-gb-36935-13.html and how I dealt with the different shaped bombardiers glass is shown a couple of pages later in post #214

    There were a lot of changes throughout the B-24 J production blocks such as waist gun installation and side nose window type, so having the serial number or a picture of the aircraft in question would help in nailing down just what to include in your build. I have a very good book on the subject so maybe I can be of some help.
     
  4. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,757
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
  5. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    9,728
    Likes Received:
    194
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Bridge & Highway Construction Inspector
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    Here's a couple of pictures that illustrate the difference between the noses. First one is a Lib with the Ford kit nose and the second one is one of the most common non Ford noses. Both have the Emerson nose turret. The third picture is a slightly different Non Ford installation with a Consolidated tail turret.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,757
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
    And here the B-24J FO in flight. The pic source .... the net. Also, please notice the different "window" for the side gunner.


    B-24J FO.jpg
     
  7. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Messages:
    47,719
    Likes Received:
    1,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    And windscreens and cockpit side screens could be different too, even on similar models, with, for example, the armoured version on some ETO aircraft.
    And Glenn, my copy of that book arrived today - I've only leafed through it quickly so far, but I sure see what you mean about all the variations and mixes of bits here and there!
    Just waiting for two more B-25 books to arrive too. Got one coming from the USA, which only cost £6.50 including shipping - and I've just seen the same book advertised, in paper back, for £140 !!!!
    Also, Haynes have just released the B-24 in their 'Owners/Workshop Manual' range.
    Looks like I'll have a lot of scratch building to do on the Monogram kit, externally and internally, depending on the subject I end up choosing!
     
  8. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    9,728
    Likes Received:
    194
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Bridge & Highway Construction Inspector
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    I knew you'd like that book Terry, and what fun would it be with out at least a little scratchbuilding.

    The picture Wojtek posted is definitely a Ford H either a J-1 FO or a J-5-FO. It has the higher sill inclosed waist windows of the ford H's and J's through the J-5, the smaller navigators window and the deleted windows along the side it the tunnel hatch. The rams horn venturi tubes were eliminated after the J-5-FO production block and replaced with smaller ones on the lower left side of the nose which are only really visible in close up pics. The cockpit side window varied much, either flat or various bulged shapes.You really need a picture of the particular aircraft to be sure. The bulged ones started disappearing on later B-24Js because the distortion they caused were making formation flying difficult. As Terry mentioned an armored was also installed on 8th AF Libs at modification centers. These also appear in many 15th AF aircraft along with the cockpit side armor plate due to many to these 24s being transferred from the 8th when Doolittle took over and decided to get rid of all the Liberators.
     
  9. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Messages:
    47,719
    Likes Received:
    1,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    Just noticed I typed 'B-25' instead of of B-24 !
    Rob, can you do me a favour please? Could you confirm that the cockpit floor is Part 19 in the Revell / Monogram 1/48th scale B-24J ?
    The part is missing from the kit I got a Duxford, and the instructions are a photocopy of the 1976 issue of the kit (which has the Shep Paine diorama booklet in the box too). I need to request the part on Revell's on-line system, so I need to be sure. I can't see them altering part numbers in the same kit, but just in case ......
     
  10. Trebor

    Trebor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,418
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    KCLS
    #10 Trebor, Sep 19, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2013
    damn fine work on that liberator, Glenn. I especially love how you did the "T" markings. dunno how I'm gonna do the Circle "A" with SoCo III being polished aluminum. but this is hugely helpful. MUCH better than spending over $30 for a part that'll be more trouble than it's worth.

    Confirmed, Terry. Part 19
     
  11. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,757
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
    Believing the net and the caption of the pic it's the J-1-FO variant.
     
  12. Capt. Vick

    Capt. Vick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,906
    Likes Received:
    639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Long Island, New York
    #12 Capt. Vick, Sep 19, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2013
    I can't recommend the book "Consolidated Mess" more strongly for all your (nose turreted) Liberator needs! Act now! :D
     
  13. Capt. Vick

    Capt. Vick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,906
    Likes Received:
    639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Long Island, New York
    Terry,

    I had to get a replacement thread for the little tractor that comes with that same Monogram kit release and Revell was very helpful. Evidently they are one of the good guys, but there was some confusion with the part numbers between it and the airplane. I don't think you'll have that problem, just saying.

    Jim

    PS Even started a thread about it "Monogram 1/48 B-24J Liberator parts needed!"
     
  14. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Messages:
    47,719
    Likes Received:
    1,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    I totally agree with Jim. Couldn't sleep last night and read it from cover to cover - an excellent book, extremely informative.
    Thanks for the info Jim, and thanks for confirming Rob. The Revell parts service on their web-site seems efficient, and it states that it should be about six weeks for the part to arrive. No hurry on my part, so good stuff.
     
  15. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    9,728
    Likes Received:
    194
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Bridge & Highway Construction Inspector
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois
    Maybe I was on the wrong website when I made my request for a F-102 windscreen. I never heard back from them. Been thinking of buying another kit just for the part but haven't seen on at a reasonable price. What's the website you guys are using?

    and Jim, that's the book I mentioned earlier but forgot to put in the title. Absolutely fantastic book! A must have for anyone wanting to make an accurate model of a B-24. Can't wait until he comes out with the greenhouse nose book. It's got me itching to pull another B-24 kit out of my stash.
     
  16. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Messages:
    47,719
    Likes Received:
    1,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Cheshire, UK
    Glenn, I just went to Revell - The Authentic Model-Building Experience since 1945
    There's a button for parts and service. Click on this, and the page will appear requesting your details, the kit name and number, part description and part number, and the fault - example, missing, broken etc.
    Once you've submitted the request, you'll get a reference number, and an e-mail confirming that your request is being processed. It also advises that you contact them if nothing is heard within six weeks.
     
  17. Trebor

    Trebor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    2,418
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    KCLS
    heh, I just realized, this makes 20 unbuilt aircraft in my stash! O_O that's 14 airliners, one military transport, 3 General Aviation planes, one Cold War jet, and one warbird. I gotta stop buying more models and get up off my lazy butt and start building! :lol:
     
  18. Capt. Vick

    Capt. Vick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,906
    Likes Received:
    639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Long Island, New York
    Totally agreed amigo!!!!
     
  19. Capt. Vick

    Capt. Vick Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    7,906
    Likes Received:
    639
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Long Island, New York
    Same here... :(
     
  20. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
    Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    47,757
    Likes Received:
    1,538
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    A retired military Navigator/ATC, FIS controller
    Location:
    Poland
    Never ... never enough kits in a stash... :lol:
     
Loading...

Share This Page