B-29 Generator or Motor in tail part

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There are two types of electric motor - permanent magnet type and induction type.
The former can be used as generator but the latter not.
The relic in question is induction type.

I find no more details about the rudder/elevator servos but location and basic mechanism so far.
Need further research.

B-29_rudder_elevator_servos.jpg

Source: Mechanism for the control surfaces of the B-29
 
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Shinpachi said:
I have been wondering how the two bolts which stuck out from the outer case were used as not seen in turret photos.
I might have found a clue with this diagram.

Motor: Air Associates Model EE-125M1/EE-1370
Size: Unknown
View attachment 649593
Source: Overhaul Instructions for Air Associates Electric Motors
Click to expand...
You are right - they indicate a side mounting so that rules out turret motors and narrows it down considerably. As you say a hydraulic pump is likely as is a propeller feathering pump on aircraft with Ham Std props. A lot of aircraft of the time also carried similar fuel pumps but I do not know if the B-29 did.
 
Shimpachi-san, MiTasol,

Thank you so much.
Am I correct to say at this stage;
1) Not generator on APU, not servo motor in autopilot system, not tail gun turret motor;
2) It is considered that No.25 & 29 and the other some parts on the attached are the ones;
3) Likely be the one attached to hydraulic pump somewhere

And, if you elaborate 'propeller feathering pump on aircraft with Ham Std props', it would be greatly appreciated.
As it was found nearby tail part of the B-29, would like to check if it does not related to propeller related item.

Regards, mt
 

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Thank you Shinpachi for the photo.
Electrically that tail skid is operated in accordance with the attached wiring diagram - it is in the lower right corner
1638080502293.png


I cannot see many tail skid components in this diagram
1638081233447.png


I think we can safely eliminate the tail skid motor as that is attached by an end flange rather than a saddle
1638082868735.png


The remaining options to me are feathering pumps (one per powerplant) and fuel transfer pumps (the B-29 has three at least).
1638083164459.png

I will try and measure my DC-3 Pesco feathering pump tomorrow but I have a very busy week so may not be able to.

I have no pictures of fuel transfer pumps unfortunately.
 
M. Tanaka said:
Shimpachi-san, MiTasol,

Thank you so much.
Am I correct to say at this stage;
1) Not generator on APU, not servo motor in autopilot system, not tail gun turret motor;
2) It is considered that No.25 & 29 and the other some parts on the attached are the ones;
3) Likely be the one attached to hydraulic pump somewhere

And, if you elaborate 'propeller feathering pump on aircraft with Ham Std props', it would be greatly appreciated.
As it was found nearby tail part of the B-29, would like to check if it does not related to propeller related item.

Regards, mt
Click to expand...
I do not ensure the exact model number for the relic as there seemed several similar models but your summary is what I have suggested, Tanaka-san.
Thanks.
 
Getting back to the start line, I think this gentleman, Keiho Shimada, in the video I introduced with my post #10 could know more details.
He says he was working for an arsenal of present NTT in Chofu during the war to build submarine detectors.

The video does not tell more details but, in my impression as a postwar kid to watch it, some parts of the crashed B-29 would have been sent to his arsenal to research and he may have brought it back to his home as a war souvenir after the war was over like many Japanese people did at the time. If so, he would have been obliged to bury it in the backyard immediately being afraid of the interrogation by GHQ but finally dug it up decades later to donate it to the local museum. This depends on how the relic came to the museum.

Mr. Keiho Shimada
Keiho Shimada.jpg


Original video
 
Shimpachi-san,
Thank you; I am trying to get contact information of Mr. Shimada, though not sure if I could communicate with him as he should be now 92.
Further information may follow.
---
Anyway, if my understanding is correct; it would be No.25+29 of the below breakdown chart, consisting of the inner/outer parts as the two photos below. Unlikely a hydraulic pump considering two amounts, but one of the generic motor such as propeller feathering pumps (one per powerplant) or fuel transfer pumps (the B-29 has three at least).

Then, just to double-confirm where possibly it was;
- 'propeller feathering pump' is for propeller pitch control, located in each engine
- 'fuel transfer pump' is for the transfer among bomb-bay and wing tanks, e.g. 'G' below, but 'H' Fuel Booster Pump maybe similar. (chart is from page 114 of 'Owner's Workshop Manual' attached below)

Can we conclude like this? It looks not from tail part of the B-29, but it could happen after mid-air collision and crash after that.
16C0B95E-D187-4293-9681-1DBC491E0C1B.jpg
 

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My apologies for the slow reply - too busy
Attached are photos of my Pesco Feathering pump as fitted to C-47 and many other aircraft. My apologies for it being dirty but I did not have time to clean it
As you can see it is a Pesco type 280-2C and totally different from the Pesco 1E-620 shown in the drawing from the B-29 manual. It is however apparently the same construction as the motor M. Tanaka is investigating but it is a smaller unit being just 11cm diameter.
1638590531632.png

1638590624290.png
 
My hat off to the great efforts for research, Tanaka-san, and tons of precious technical data, MiTasol.
My first impression to see the relic pictures was that someone could have buried it carefully wrapping with oil paper or putting it in a box as I found no trace of soils between the armature and the stator.
 
The fuel transfer pump looks an explosion proof type or a sealed type as its role is sensitive. The booster pump would be same in its role.
This is my quick research for them but the right answer for your question, Tanaka-san, will be the electric motor for the propeller feathering pump as MiTasol has indicated.

7__62960.1611869415.jpg

Source: Overhaul Instructions for Fuel and Water Pumps
 
Mr. Shimada's testimony part from 7:43 to 8:39 in the video.

Narration: Keiho Shimada 84. When the B-29 crashed (on April 7, 1945), he was an engineer of Ministry of Communication (present NTT). No sooner he heard the news than he hurried to the crash site.

Shimada: My job was to build submarine detectors for aircraft. I thought the equipment onboard the B-29 would be so excellent I went there to bring them back for research. I saw a torn off part of the fuselage (tail part). It looked almost 2 meters high or higher. As the area was blocked by the military police, I was unable to get any closer.

Narration: All the wreck of the B-29 crashed in Chofu district were preserved and recovered by the military police shortly. A bomb dropped in the Kokuryo block was not recovered and had been left there as it was ( till 2008. This is the main theme of this video).

What Shimada saw
Keiho Shimada 01.jpg


How the airframe scattered (unexploded bomb in the center)
Chofu_01.jpg


Recovered 2000lb bomb in 2008
Chofu_02.jpg


How the B29 was attacked
Chofu_03.jpg
 
Shimpachi-san,

Thank you always.
Actually, Iwasaki-san, another old man on the video, is the man who has directly asked me for the research.
I am keeping updated him of any developments here.

If I add Iwasaki-san's comment;
- The parts was found in a farm, nearby the tail part was fallen
- It was not taken away by military police after the crash, but left underground until the farm owner found it in his work a few years later
- Iwasaki-san received it from the farmer who decided to dispose it 5 - 10 years back from now, when it was donated to the museum
Not yet successfully contacted to Mr. Shimada, but he did not come close enough to B-29, as he told in the video.

If we come to a fair conclusion and ready to make an explanation text draft for the museum, which I will share, I would like to add your nicknames, Shimpachi-san, MiTasol. Please allow me.

Best regards,
M. Tanaka
 
Good day M Tanaka
Generally speaking I do not seek recognition for any help I give however I have no strong objection to being named. I will leave the decision to you.
Mi Tasol
 
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