B25 Mitchell help

[Beaufort]

Hi,

I'd like some info on the gun armament of RAF Mitchell III's.

Mitchell II was the RAF designation for the B25C/D.

Mitchell III was the RAF designation for the B25J.

It's easy to tell the difference between them as the top turret of a II is towards the back of the aircraft while the top turret of a III is near the front.

What I want to know is what if any fixed forward firing guns RAF Mitchell III's had.

Many American J's were fitted with 4 guns in blister pods on the side of the fuselage (you can see them below the cockpit in the pic) and I want to know whether the RAF Mitchell III's had those pods.

I assume they didn't as the RAF didn't use the B25 for straffing but I'd really like to confirm it either way.

I'd also like to know if the RAF III's had any fixed guns in the glazed nose.

I asked this question on another site but unfortunately every reply was mistaken, referring to Mitchell II's, USAAF aircraft or Warbirds.

I'd like to confirm this with wartime pics as you can't rely on the generic info in aircraft profiles reference books.

I've looked on the web for photos of RAF Mitchell III's without success.

I've a book about 2 Group which has a few pics but the're so poorly reproduced you can't tell whether they have the blister pods or not.

If anyone has any pics or deffinitive info they could share that would be great.

Cheers

 

[Lightning Guy]

As far as I can tell, every verstion of the B-25J/Mitchell III was equipped with the four blister guns on the sides of the nose. Each gun was equipped with 400 rounds. Additionally, every block of the -J had one fixed .50cal weapon in the nose (300rpg) and beginning with the -J-20 they carried two. I have no idea which block the British planes came from or if any of the British planes were modified with the solid nose.

 

[Beaufort]

Hi, thanks for the reply.

I had another trawl round the web but still can find no pics of RAF Mitchell III's but did see some American J' series aircraft without the pods, maybe they were fitted in the factory but removed later.

It's one of those things now, bugging me, I really want to see a wartime pic to end my curiosity.

Cheers

 

[Beaufort]

Success!

Someone has scanned a couple of pics for me.

It seems the first pic with the pods is how the aircraft was delivered, the second pic in which they don't have them is from an airfield on the continent with the aircraft gearing up for a raid, the pods having been removed for operations to save weight.

I've also got hold of a book called 'B25 Mitchell Units of the MTO' which has loads of pictures of American B25J's operating over Italy without the pods.

 

[evangilder]

Good info, Beaufort. I have always been partial to B-25s. Nice pics too, I just wish there wasn't a seam in the second shot.

 

[R Pope]

Great bombers, but LOUD! They say you can tell a Mitchell pilot from a co-pilot by which ear he turns toward you when you speak. The one by the window is always stone deaf!

 

[evangilder]

That could be said about alot of WWII warbirds, and some cargo ones as well. What I always found interesting about B-25s is they always sound awful at idle, backfires and coughing and sputtering. But once they get some throttle applied to them, they roar to life and sound smooth.

 

[Beaufort]

A nice noisy movie of a B25 here.

http://www.pozefilm.de/warbird.html

What I always found interesting about B-25s is they always sound awful at idle, backfires and coughing and sputtering. But once they get some throttle applied to them, they roar to life and sound smooth.

I see, or rather hear what you mean.

 

[evangilder]

That's nice, at the beginning you can heard the popping and all! There are some great videos on there. The Corsair video was cool too! I think I will end up grabbing all of those for my own consumption. Thanks for the link! 8)

 

[evangilder]

I have been looking at some of the others, nice stuff!

Der Flug Werk FW 190: 3. Testflug ist ausgezeichnet!

Hope I didn't butcher the German too badly. It has been many years since I spoke it, and then just enough to get around.

 

[Nonskimmer]

I agree, it's a great little collection of clips! You're right evan, they do sound like hell on the ground!
I really enjoyed seeing the Lancaster in the air. I've been wanting to take a trip west to see the one just outside of Hamilton, but chances are I wouldn't get a chance to go while she's being flown. From what I understand, they fly her rarely these days.

Thanks for the link, Beaufort!

 

[Lightning Guy]

The B-25 played a huge role in the Pacific and the effects it had on Japanese shipping and airbases was incredible. Inspite of that, I was always more partial to the A-20.

 

[evangilder]

Well, I am partial to Mitchell's for a couple of reasons. We had one outside of the Milwaukee Airport "Mitchell Field". The second is because my cousin was on the Doolittle Raid. The A-20 was cool too.

 

[Nonskimmer]

Your cousin was with the Doolittle raid, les's grandfather was an ace in Pappy Boyington's squadron...

What can I say?

 

[evangilder]

It's funny, just about every vet of WWII I talk to, no matter what they did, basically say the same thing; we had a job to do, and we did it. One of the gentlemen that I am interviewing for my book was awarded the Navy Cross (Just under the medal of honor) for his contribution in the Battle of the Leyte Gulf. He was one of the guys who put a torpedo into the Zuikaku. The guy is very decorated, yet he seems just a humble, regular guy. I am proud of my family service, but they deserve all the credit.

On that subject, my wife and I had dinner with one of her cousins a while back. She dug out some old pictures that we pored over. Then she pulled out "The Picture" as I call it. She asked, do you know what this is? My answer was an easy one, I replied "That's the surrender signing ceremony on the USS Missouri in Tokyo Bay". Her cousin smiled, glad that I knew what I was looking at. It was then that she pointed to a radio man on the deck above and asked "Do you know who THAT is?" I was stumped. She then said "That's my brother!" I was floored.

So if you see a picture of the Missouri with the signing ceremony and you look at the deck above and behind the Americans, look for the only guy in the blue denim, that is my wife's cousin, Ted Kramer. His picture is also on the Missouri today. He is in Nvay Blues and wearing headphones. He did the audio recording that day, which was used by all the networks. He spent the night before putting the gear together and using paper clips and various items just to get it to work! When the pictures came out, his mother admonished him for being the only one not dressed up! I am glad though, makes him easy to spot! Unfortunately, Ted passed away a number of years ago. I am sure he would have had some stories.

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

i find the quote "i'm not a hero, just a survivor, all the heros are dead" extremely inspirational and sums up most of their attitudes pretty well, but the time is now to speak about their memories, before they're gone for good..............

 

[ffmedic87]

The B-25 has always had a big place in the heart. My Uncle was KIA over Luzon ROP 19 May 45 in one. We really don't know much about what happened. Just that it was a training flight and another plane clipped his wing and they both went down. He saw combat action with the RCAF and the USAAF and was killed in a training flight.

 

[Nonskimmer]

That's a real shame. I hate hearing stories of guys killed in training after surviving combat.

 

[cheddar cheese]

Yeah thats such a bad way to go.

 

[ffmedic87]

The worst part about it is tha fact we really don't and most likely will never
know all the information about it. I tried to contact the government agencies involved with this stuff and have hit nothing but dead ends.