Bf 109F-2 Walter Oesau, need opinion

Discussion in 'Aircraft Requests' started by le_steph40, Jan 18, 2011.

  1. le_steph40

    le_steph40 Well-Known Member

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    Hello,

    I'm a new member here and, first I would thank you for welcoming me home...
    I'm working on the 1/48 ICM Bf 109F-2 and I would like to build the aircraft flown by Walter Oesau early in July 1941 (Wk.nr. 8240):
    http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/at...09-oesau-bf109f2-8240-d-chevron-41-58-b_a.jpg
    I need your opinion regarding the rudder and the cowling color... I think the painting or camo scheme on these 2 pieces is not the same that the rest of the aircraft... Is it possible that the rudder and the cowling are RLM04 yellow covered by RLM74 or/and RLM75 color ?

    Thanks in advance for your help.
    Stéph
    (Very sorry if my English language is bad...)
     
  2. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    Welcome to the forum Steph.
    The rudder could very well be yellow - see the other '109 in the background, which shows a contrast. I think the cowling has just been given a heavier mottle, possibly after a re-paint, or might even be from another aircraft. I doubt it would have been all yellow at this period in the East, although the bottom cowling panel might have been.
     
  3. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

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    Not sure the rudder is yellow, has a heavy mottle over what could be RLM 76....however the heavy mottling could be hiding yellow??

    The victory markings on the rudder are White bars with no outline. The top row consists of 8 victories the first 2 have British roundels above the bars the others Red russian stars. The second row 10 bars all with red stars.
    There is a Yellow fuselage band immediately behind the fuselage cross and the vertical gruppe bar sits in the middle of the band.
    The cowling is also heavily mottled... It is possible that the cowling may have been yellow, certainly a number of 109's from different JG's had yellow cowls which were overpainted during the early stages of Barbarossa, but in this instance the cowl may not be yellow at all?
    It's a coin toss when trying to interpret black and white photo's....your call in the end!:D
     
  4. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    I'm not sure that is mottle on the rudder Wayne. Apart from dot-clash in the pic, due to its being a copy from a litho-printed copy, there's also some slight reticulation. A close inspection of the area where the kill bars are, shows an even colour which matches the remainder, and is a different tone to the base colour of the fuselage (presumably RLM76, possibly 65), and I think this is yellow. It's possible that a mottle has been applied to this, but doubtful, and again, I think this is reticulation in the image.
    The yellow paint used for tactical markings up to this period was a distemper type paint, and painting over the top of this would cause the yellow to peel, crack, flake etc., unless another distemper paint was used - highly unlikely for a camouflage colour.
    The cowling might have been yellow at one time, for instance immediately before the move from France, but again this would have been distemper, and would have been removed by washing it in petrol (gasoline). The apparent difference in density between the cowling and the rest of the fuselage might be, and probably is, due to the remainder weathering, where the cowling paint is relatively fresh, having been protected by the previous washable yellow coat.
     
  5. FlexiBull

    FlexiBull Member

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    Think this might help. There is also a fuselage band.

    Flexi
     

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  6. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    It seems that the rudder was yellow painted with mottling on that.
     
  7. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    #7 Airframes, Jan 19, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2011
    Good stuff FB !
    I agree, yellow rudder, with a mottle, possibly of a distemper base, as it looks 'heavier' than the original fuselage mottle.
     
  8. le_steph40

    le_steph40 Well-Known Member

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    Hello All,

    Thank you for your answers. I think this model kit will be with RLM04 cowling and rudder covered by RLM74 or RLM75 ? What do you think about ?
    I think the camo scheme is very special, heavy mottle on the sides of the fuselage... I ask myself if it's really a RLM75/75/76 camo scheme...?

    Regards
    Stéph
     
  9. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    #9 Wurger, Jan 20, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2011
    I don't think the camo of the Bf109F is something special. The almost entire plane seems to be of RLM74/75/76. But I would like to make a focus on the rudder and the engine cowling.These seem to be painted in the same way. It is quite nice seen in these enlarged shots and the pic from the link above.
    It looks smilar to the engine cowling of von Hahn's Bf109F-2. The area was initially yellow painted and then the RLM74 applied on that. But I might be wrong of course. And certainly, the yellow band on the fuselage can be seen as well.
     

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  10. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

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    It is always difficult to determine colours, and i am always hesitant to say one way or the other and would rather offer alternatives but after further study of the pics I have I DO think the cowl and rudder WERE yellow and a heavy mottle applied over the top.
    As Wojtek points out both the the cowl and rudder are similarly painted and clearly different from the rest of the aircraft, Why? Most likely to cover yellow recognition markings. As i mentioned in my previous post there were yellow marked aircraft from each of the JG's from their western front service and many photo's showing this and subsequent overpainting to tone down the yellow.
     
  11. Wurger

    Wurger Siggy Master
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    I agree with Wayne.
     
  12. le_steph40

    le_steph40 Well-Known Member

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    hello,
    Another (and last) question about this aircraft (I begin the paint very soon...). Do you think she has yellow lower wingtips ?
    TIA, regards
    Stéph
     
  13. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

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    While the wing tips are not visible, it is more likely than not that this aircraft had the yellow lower wingtips.
     
  14. le_steph40

    le_steph40 Well-Known Member

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    Hello,
    I keep working on my Bf 109F-2 flown by Walter Oesau (W.Nr. 8240) and I just find an information about this aircraft... Apparently, this aircraft was flown one year later by another German Ace: Karl-Heinz Weber from 7./JG51. He flown it during summer 1942 to claim some victories.
    I found these informations here: Aces of the Luftwaffe - Karl-Heinz Weber but I'm surprised by the tactical number: "white 0" ???
    Is there anybody who knows why this aircraft wore this number "0" ? Any information regarding this aircraft in 7./JG51 ?
    So, I'm looking for informations regarding the aircraft(s) flown by Weber during summer 1943 (Fw 190A-4/5/6)... Anybody to help me please ? Or should I open a new thread ?

    TIA, regards
    Steph
     
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