Cost of British military aircraft and engines?

The Mosquito dropped from £6,000 in 1941

I double ckecked the data I saved and the person who wrote it was first talking about woking hours. Maybe he got confused.

Tomo, have you not come across the prices paid by Yugoslavia when importing aircraft prior to the war? It would be interesting as the YuAF had an interesting mix.

alejandro_ said:

...
Tomo, have you not come across the prices paid by Yugoslavia when importing aircraft prior to the war? It would be interesting as the YuAF had an interesting mix.

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Unfortunately, I didn't make any serious research on the Royal Yu air force.
Good idea, though.

Hop said:

There's a list of the average cost of British bombers in: https://ses.library.usyd.edu.au/bitstream/2123/664/2/adt-NU20050104.11440202whole.pdf

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I'm sorry this is off topic but, chapter three is a masterpiece of delusional thinking. There is no more polite way to say it than that. Much of it is a mushy pile of ambiguity, bad anecdotal evidence, and assumptions. I get the distinct impression the author had a conclusion and simply stopped the moment he found anything that could be made to fit his conclusion. His claim that British engines were dominating the US commercial market is very easily proven false. Nor is Fedden's perception that P&W was reverse engineering the Jupiter V evidence of reverse engineering. Considering Bristol and P&W had differing design philosophies I very much doubt there would have been all that much that P&W would have found useful. Fedden was a very competent engineer but the Jupiter wasn't some superlative groundbreaking design. In fact the Jupiter didn't have particularly good sales until the Jupiter VI of 1926. This was the first production model with a forged crankcase and one piece master rods. Before this the Armstrong-Siddeley Jaguar was the more dominant engine in British services.

On the aircraft side all you need to do is look at the first flight dates of various British commercial and general aviation types and compare them to foreign types in the same time period and it becomes very clear that British manufacturers were pretty conservative in their designs. It's even more apparent when you look at construction details. All metal stressed-skin construction had been around for a decade by the time the Monomail made its first flight. The Monomail* didn't advance the level of aviation technology, every feature existed before in other designs. What it did new was combined them into one design. As a whole, and even though they had many of the early pioneers in the advanced features that embody the Monomail, the British aircraft industry failed recognize the significance of these features. Fahey's 'good reasons' are actually points in favor of those he is criticizing.

* I should note that the Monomail was first but not the only one. Both the Lockheed Orion (all wood construction) and the Northrop Alpha (fixed landing gear) largely embodied the same ideas.

Anything in here that would interest you Tomo?

fubar57 said:

Anything in here that would interest you Tomo?

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Thank you, Geo I already have the book, but never looked at prices listed there. Doh.

From pp82/83 of chapter 9 of:

The Arsenal of Democracy: FDR, Detroit, and an Epic Quest to Arm an America at War by A.J. Baime

(Quote)
[.....]
Four days later, just before midnight, an armored car pulled up to Gate 4 of
the Rouge. Two soldiers unloaded top-secret blueprints for the Rolls-Royce
Merlin aircraft engine, the British-designed power plant that was the jewel of the
Royal Air Force. Following the blueprints, the Fords received the aircraft engine
itself. Knudsen arrived in Dearborn from Washington to help study the project.
On June 13(1940), Edsel returned to Washington with Sorensen to finalize the deal.
They arrived at 8:30 AM and headed to the Mayflower Hotel for breakfast.
Knudsen met them there. All talk was of aviation engines—the scintillating
technical challenge of producing them en masse, according to automobile
manufacturing principles.
Edsel appeared tired that morning. Not long before, he had checked himself
into Henry Ford Hospital with crippling stomach pain; doctors had run
uncomfortable tests, making him imbibe barium solutions and forcing tubes
down his throat. They were unable to diagnose anything. "I was concerned about
Edsel," Sorensen later remembered. "The doctors were keeping tabs on him. . . .
When he showed signs of indigestion, from which he suffered a great deal, his
father would be impatient about that. He would criticize Edsel unmercifully."
In Washington, Edsel and Sorensen negotiated a contract for 9,000 RollsRoyce Merlin aircraft engines. Six thousand would go to the British, and the
other 3,000 to the US military. The government would pay Ford a provisional
price of $16,000 per engine (about $10 per horsepower). Edsel kept his father
abreast of negotiations by phone, carefully explaining the situation so as not to
upset him. To Edsel's amazement, he was able to convince his father that the
family should take on the project. As Sorensen later wrote in his diary: "I am
surprised . . . Henry Ford had stated that he would not make any war supplies for
any foreign nation. . . . No one could have been more careful in keeping him
fully informed than Edsel and I had been."
[.....]
(Unquote)

Shortly after Henry Ford changed his mind and backed out of the project.

The Merlin went on to be produced by Packard.

I have no cost figures for the Packard Merlin, but I imagine that it would be for an amount similar to what was offered Ford, for an equivalent production run.

Deleted member 68059 said:

In that case you ought to buy a copy of: "Industry and Air Power" by Sebastian Ritchie. Which has a lot of stuff of British engine costs.

I have a copy here - but I`m really sorry to be unhelpful but I really cant be bothered to leaf through it all evening digging figures out - if I were you just get a copy!

But just for example on page 128:

"Bristol Mercury average cost per engine £1915 (first 500) ....£1197 (3rd batch of 500)

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A bit late to the party here, but just got this book. Disappointingly little on actual unit costs (a lot of data is either indexes or unnamed 'Bomber A' etc.) although interesting in lots of other ways.

As well as the above costs for the Mercury (from the shadow factories not Bristol), there is for the Ford Merlin:

• June 1941 £5,640 , March 1942 £2,484, end war £1,180 (p.212).
• Ford cost 30% less than other manufacturers (p.246).
  [Edit: Ritchie says this is because they were able to focus on long production runs of a handful of proven Marks, not because they were intrinsically awesome.]

alejandro_ said:

Hello Tomo, as others are saying the data are likely to be fragmented. I have also spent many hours trying to compare US/Soviet/German financial data and I would not recommend it! Anyway, this is from a discussion a few years ago:

The Mosquito dropped from £6,000 in 1941 to £4,200 in 1944, the Lancaster from £22,000 to £15,200 in the same period, despite substantial rises in wages.

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Shortround6 said:

Well something seems to way off even on the examples given.

A Spitfire MkVB from the Castle Bromwich plant cost the taxpayer about £9,850

The Mosquito dropped from £6,000 in 1941

Engine £2,000 0 0

Something isn't adding up very well????

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Similar Mosquito & Lancaster info appears on p.212 of Industry and Air Power (except it says 1945 not 1944 for the Mosquito and £15,500 not £15,200 for the Lancaster). But it refers to 'labour and subcontract cost' only.

According to p.26 the Air Ministry provided "engines, instruments, armament and wireless apparatus" free so that probably explains the discrepancies.

at ease said:

Shortly after Henry Ford changed his mind and backed out of the project.

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But Ford used the Merlin data they had received to build a tank engine, just as the Merlin served as the basis for the British Meteor tank engine.

And the US Govt had to pay RR a licensing fee of $1500 for each US Merlin produced.

tomo pauk said:

Thank you, Geo I already have the book, but never looked at prices listed there. Doh.

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Where, the only price I can find in the online version is for the Beardmore 120hp!?

What does an aircraft cost has the answer it depends. The following is a collection of figures and show plenty of variation. Things like whether spare parts are included, if a company is making more than one product how things like head office costs are allocated, whether depreciation of the building, cost of test flights etc. is included. Add the reduction in prices on long production runs.

Hurricanes through the ages, Ministry of Aircraft Production Price Books, paid to company, this is NOT the total cost for a flyable aircraft. Edit to put in omitted data.


Similar to above, 336 Mosquito II aircraft 1 to 50 £13,600, aircraft 51-150 £11,250, aircraft 151-250 £9,650, aircraft 51-336 £9,100. B.IV aircraft 1-90 £10,000, aircraft 91-290 £9,012, for 360 mark VI £10,057.5, for 90 PR.IX £10,767.5, for 54 B.IX £10,817.5, PR.XVI aircraft 1-52 £9,961, aircraft 53-273 £9,436, aircraft 274-432 £8,925 (first 52 non tropical standard), NF.XIX £8,955

The Mosquito contracts above for de Havilland, Percival, 250 B.XVI, aircraft 1-20 £13,185, aircraft 21-50 £11,575, aircraft 51-100 £10,525m final 150 £9,115.

For those who want to talk price rises, 38 Nimrod MR mark 1, £2,497,859 per aircraft for development and supply (for delivery May 1969 to September 1970)

British Archives AVIA 15/950
Cancelled orders
No / Factory / Aircraft / Total Cost / Unit Cost
200 / Fairey / Beaufighter / 6,130,000 / 30,650
50 / De Havilland / Queen Bee / 75,000 / 1,500
6 / Blackburn / Botha / 155,000 / 25,833.33
Absorbed from Dominion Orders
4 / / Hurricane / 34,000 / 8,500
18 / / Beaufighter / 406,000 / 22,555.56
300 / / Whittle / 6,450,000 / 21,500
Proposed orders June 1941 (Proctors for RN)
400 / / Lancaster / 17,700,000 / 44,250
200 / / Beaufort / 3,640,000 / 18,200
1000 / / Spitfire / 10,123,000 / 10,123
400 / / Oxford / 2,880,000 / 7,200
300 / / Mosquito / 5,685,000 / 18,950
250 / / Halifax / 10,938,000 / 43,752
200 / / Typhoon / 3,340,000 / 16,700
320 / / Stirling / 16,736,000 / 52,300
45 / / Sunderland / 2,577,000 / 57,266.67
600 / / Warwick / 22,860,000 / 38,100
433 / / Wellington / 11,994,000 / 27,699.77
300 / / Barracuda / 3,750,000 / 12,500
50 / / Proctor / 135,000 / 2,700

Orders awaiting review 31 May 1941. Spare engine cost is NOT for one new engine, rather an allowance for 1 spare engine per X new aircraft.
Company / Aircraft / No / unit cost / Spare engines / Cost+spare / Total order
Armstrong Whitworth / Lancaster / 200 / 41,400 / 1,750 / 43,150 / 8,630,000
Bristol / Beaufort (Merlin) / 200 / 17,400 / 800 / 18,200 / 3,640,000
Castle Bromwich / Spitfire V or VI / 850 / 9,500 / 450 / 9,950 / 8,457,500
Castle Bromwich / Spitfire III / 150 / 10,500 / 600 / 11,100 / 1,665,000
De Havilland / Oxford / 600 / 6,800 / 400 / 7,200 / 4,320,000
De Havilland / Mosquito / 250 / 18,500 / 450 / 18,950 / 4,737,500
English Electric / Halifax / 200 / 42,000 / 1,750 / 43,750 / 8,750,000
Metropolitan Vickers / Lancaster / 250 / 43,600 / 1,750 / 45,350 / 11,337,500
Short / Stirling I / 120 / 49,800 / 2,500 / 52,300 / 6,276,000
Short Harland / Stirling I / 250 / 49,800 / 2,500 / 52,300 / 13,075,000
Short / Sunderland / 50 / 52,100 / 1,600 / 53,700 / 2,685,000
Short Harland / Sunderland / 25 / 60,100 / 1,600 / 61,700 / 1,542,500
Vickers Blackpool / Warwick / 400 / 36,100 / 2,000 / 38,100 / 15,240,000
Vickers Chester / Warwick / 400 / 36,100 / 2,000 / 38,100 / 15,240,000
Vickers Chester / Wellington / 400 / 26,400 / 1,300 / 27,700 / 11,080,000

Supply Board Memorandum 207/41 aircraft program review. Value is for cancelled orders, All up +spare engines for current orders.
Aircraft / Company / No / Value / All up + Spare engines / Unit cost
Blenheim / Rootes / 170 / 2,324,000 / / 13,670.59
Blenheim / Avro / 622 / 9,260,000 / / 14,887.46
Hampden / English Electric / 130 / 3,129,000 / / 24,069.23
Manchester / Avro / 500 / 22,568,000 / / 45,136
Manchester / Metro-Vickers / 200 / 9,027,000 / / 45,135
Lancaster / Avro / 450 / / 19,340,000 / 42,977.78
Lancaster / Metro-Vickers / 257 / / 11,204,000 / 43.595.33
Halifax / Fairey / 150 / / 6,572,000 / 43.813.33
Wellington / Vickers Blackpool / 250 / 6,875,000 / / 27,500
Spitfire / Vickers Supermarine / 120 / 1,406,000 / / 11,716.67
Tornado / Avro / 400 / / 5,760,000 / 14,400
Typhoon / Hawker / 300 / / 5,010,000 / 16,700
Defiant / Boulton Paul / 220 / 4,308,000 / / 19,581.82
Mosquito / De Havilland / 50 / / 948,000 / 18,960
Sunderland / Shorts Windemere / 25 / / 1,343,000 / 53,720
Lysander / Westland / 490 / 5,285,000 / / 10,785.71
Firefly / General Aircraft / 200 / 2,610,000 / / 13,050
Barracuda / Westland / 250 / 3,360,000 / / 13,440
Master / Phillps&Powis Reading / 500 / 3,765,000 / / 7,530
Master / Phillps&Powis Doncaster / 300 / 2,259,000 / / 7,530
Master / Phillps&Powis S. Marston / 400 / 3,063,000 / / 7,657.5
Queen Bee / Morris Motors / 50 / 75,000 / / 1,500
Anson / Avro / 700 / 5,688,000 / / 8,125.71

AVIA 10/267 As of 22 October 1942 Man hours absorbed in aircraft
Aircraft / Contractor / Date / Man hours / Note
Stirling I / Short Swindon / 201st Aircraft / 129,944 /
Lancaster I / Avro / 201st Aircraft / 74,319 /
Halifax II / Handley page / 201st Aircraft / 98,246 /
Wellington Ic / Vickers Weybridge / 19-Nov-41 / 53,969 /
Blenheim IV / Bristol / 22-Dec-39 / 34,813 /
Beaufighter I / Bristol / 31-Jul-41 / 36,615 /
Beaufighter II / Bristol / 31-Jul-41 / 37,933 /
Hurricane IID / Hawker / 22-Dec-41 / 19,560 /
Spitfire Vc / Supermarine / 23-Apr-42 / 19,086 /
Typhoon Ia / Hawker/Gloster / 26-Jan-42 / 28,756 / Preliminary estimate, assuming present methods of production
Typhoon Ia / Hawker/Gloster / 10-Jan-42 / 22,349 / Preliminary estimate, assuming full advantage is taken of best available manufacturing methods
Beaufort I / Bristol / 5-Sep-40 / 40,418 /
Sunderland III / Blackburn Dumbarton / 28-Feb-42 / 123,556 / Preliminary estimate
Albacode / Fairey (Hayes) / 20-Aug-41 / 24,852 /
Barracuda / Fairey (Stockport) / 15-Jun-42 / 27,052 / Preliminary estimate
Fulmar II / Fairey (Stockport) / 11-Apr-41 / 24,787 /

AVIA 15/2389 covers the sale of RAF aircraft to France in 1945/6, prices (costs) quoted, in pounds, completed aircraft,
37-40,000 Lancaster I
40,000 Halifax (would be mark III or later)
15,000 Mosquito VI
16,000 Mosquito 30
16,000 Mosquito PR XVI
16,300 Mosquito PR.34
10,000 Spitfire IX
9,700 Spitfire XIV
13,650 Typhoon
26,000 Wellington XIII
25,000 Wellington XIV
55-65,000 Sunderland III

Spare engine prices,
1,530 Merlin 22
1,460 Merlin 24
3,830 Hercules 100
1,480 Merlin 25
1,840 Merlin 76
1,840 Merlin 67, 72 etc.
1,900 Merlin 114
1,800 Merlin
2,300 Griffon
5,550 Sabre II
3,180 Hercules XVII
1,596 Pegasus XVIII

Australian Archives MP450/1 109 Detailed break down of Beaufort costs, per aircraft in Australian pounds.
Tooling 1,895, preliminary expenses 532, Improvements and extensions to properties 893 (Railways 554, Holden 186, other contractors 10, stores, flight field and plants 143), Plant, machinery and equipment 1,136, office furniture 168, which gives a total of 4,623 of establishment costs per aircraft.

Newport Workshop 1,477 (Labor 622, overhead 693, sub contract 162), Chullora Workshop 2,019 (Labor 734, overhead 1,155, sub contract 130), Islington Workshop 1,342 (Labor 516, overhead 745, sub contract 81),

Assembly Workshops Mascot/Fishermans Bend 2,510 (Labor 1,038, overhead 1,472), Holden production cost per aircraft set 2,321, Richards Industries production cost per aircraft set 292, freight 350, central office overhead 3,224, Materials (including sub contractors' costs other than Holden or Richards Industries) Holden 821 (746 plus 75 for ten percent allowance), Richards Industries 44 (40 plus 4 for ten percent allowance), Newport (795 plus 79 for ten percent allowance), Chullora (2,780 plus 278 for ten percent allowance), Islington 1,407 (1,279 plus 128 for ten percent allowance), Assembly (4,446 plus 445 for ten percent allowance). Appendix A equipment including gun turret 2,627 (Which gives the airframe cost as 27,257), Engines and Propellers (Overseas costs, Wasp engines and Curtiss propellers) 12,546 (Which gives total aircraft cost of 39,803). So 39,803 plus 4,623 gives total costs per completed aircraft as 44,426 pounds. The above excluding license fees.

Australia, NAA: A705 9/84/51 scan 9, cost of aircraft notes a Mustang in 1944 was said to cost 23,000 pounds and 43,250 in 1950, thanks to post war inflation and the increase in unit overheads from reducing the number built per month (it also quotes the Beaufort as 61,000 pounds in 1944).

Australian Archives MP450/1 109 Department of Aircraft production costs of locally made aircraft, in pounds, probably including spares, but the Wirraway and Tiger Moth costs were shared with the Department of Air and the Beaufighter, Mosquito, Mustang and Tiger Moth included costs incurred for orders for aircraft that were cancelled after the end of the war.
Beaufort, 700 built 39,514,089 total cost 56,449 unit cost
Beaufighter, 364 built 19,146,712 total cost 52,601 unit cost
Lincoln, 51 built 7,988,124 total cost 156,630 unit cost (total on order 73)
Wirraway, 755 built 3,951,438 total cost 5,234 unit cost
Boomerang 250 built 4,780,922 total cost 19,124 unit cost
Wackett trainer, 200 built 390,010 total cost 1,950 unit cost
Mustang, 179 built 6,910,696 total cost 38,607 unit cost (total on order 200)
Nene Engine, 13 built 1,402,169 total cost 107,859 unit cost (total on order 156)
Tiger Moth, 1070 built 586,434 total cost 548 unit cost
DH.84 Dragon, 87 built 659,728 total cost 7,583 unit cost
Mosquito, 209 built 17,376,878 total cost 83,143 unit cost
Vampire, 4 built 893,591 total cost 223,398 unit cost (total on order 50)
Glider, 8 built 32,224 total cost 4,028 unit cost