- Thread starter
- #21
Top Fuelers are another (they dont care how much fuel they use as long as it doesnt compression lock up !)
Nostalgia drags ??
Reno Racers
Thats all I can think of . Everyone else can use EFI and choose to do so
Engine build up
- Thread starter Bug_racer
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Top Fuelers are another (they dont care how much fuel they use as long as it doesnt compression lock up !)
Nostalgia drags ??
Reno Racers
Thats all I can think of . Everyone else can use EFI and choose to do so
- Thread starter
- #22
Maybe in the US but I doubt they will have anything here in Aus .
Yeah your right its not revolutionary , just an evolution of what was on before . With the right set up I do see the planes going faster . Turbo's are far more efficient than superchargers .
Remember the old days of F1 technology in the 80s where they were running 1000hp+ out of turbocharged 1.5l engine ? That technology is readily available and is so much more flexible these days .
I should start my own race team and build a plane , maybe call it evolutionary bandit or something
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Maybe in the US but I doubt they will have anything here in Aus .
Yeah your right its not revolutionary , just an evolution of what was on before . With the right set up I do see the planes going faster . Turbo's are far more efficient than superchargers .
Remember the old days of F1 technology in the 80s where they were running 1000hp+ out of turbocharged 1.5l engine ? That technology is readily available and is so much more flexible these days .
I should start my own race team and build a plane , maybe call it evolutionary bandit or something
You can with enough time and money, but remember, its been done before.
Scaled Composites Pond Racer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
And again, even if you got 6000 hp out of an aircraft engine, it doesn't mean you're going to much faster than what's already been seen at Reno. I'm in the jet class and the guy who took first is just short of reaching critical mach at 540 mph. A recip with a big propeller out there isn't going to see much more than 530 mph
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- Thread starter
- #24
Interesting link . Would such a light plane pass under todays rules ?
What they did was completely different and it didnt work . The reason for using modern day electronics would be too make things simpler and more effective with fuel on board . This looked like a lot of work and on a knifes edge ! Im suprised by the engine choice . I dont think they really took into account the nature of this particular engine and its drawbacks . If I was to use an automotive engine I would def test it in the car for extended periods first ! Not to mention the ECU would have been very primitive back then , there was no stand alone units back then . Completely different train of thought
You mention 530mph as the limit . Is this the record for a piston engine plane ?
Skip M
Airman
I always thought the hardest part is finding someone who will give me the money to build it.
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
I don't know what the weight of the Pond racer was I would guess it wouldn't qualify today. As far as testing of the engine and the decision to go with that engine, again I wouldn't know but coming from Rutan, be rest assured that some thought was put into the engine choice. Had it not crashed who knows how it would have matured?
Why would you test it in a car? You will not see the degree of variable RPM in an aircraft as you would see in a car as well as the engine speed if you run with a transmission as opposed to a propeller gearbox, one of the reasons why it could be difficult to put aircraft engines in cars and visa versa.
The record around the Stead course is about 528 mph for a recip. Much faster and the airframe and propeller will start hitting critical mach and one or both will start coming apart due to compressibility, so you see all the HP in the world will limit you at Reno in the Unlimiteds.
I do know there is also course rules that dictate how fast and high the races can fly and this is done based on a 'scatter pattern" should an aircraft crash. These rules were made by the FAA.
In all classes I don't think you're going to see any recip go much faster thjan 530 and the jets go faster than 540 unless there are rule and course changes, and I could tell you that too will not happen.
- Thread starter
- #27
I always thought the hardest part is finding someone who will give me the money to build it.
You just build it over 10/15 years
- Thread starter
- #28
Never set limits on something that really has none . It just makes men strive harder !
Looking into building a plane . Cost is huge , but will do it over long term . Will keep you posted on findings
PWR4360-59B
Senior Airman
- 379
- May 27, 2008
The old aircraft engines had and have most of the so called new tech stuff mentioned, way before it became known in the car world. It took pretty much 50 plus years for the automobile performance world to catch up with what was the norm in the large recip aircraft engine world in and before World war 2. Even things that you mentioned like changing ignition timing per cylinder was and is done on some large engines, but the old fassioned way, mechanically. I agree everything can stand some improvement, I have some really good ideas, and maybe someday I can put them into operation. Oh by the way aircraft engines were on NOS in the war days, so nothins new under the sun. Just like turbos and after cooling, when did that hit the cars and trucks of today? Thats a late 1940's and early 1950's deal in aircraft, it maybe sooner than that?
As far as EFI and all that fun electronic stuff, yeah its nice when its working right. I know of many cases where the good old carb does as good or better. Turbo's over mechanical blowers? A radial needs that impeller to help distribute fuel air, a turbo will negate the power demand of the blower and its been done already in large recip aircraft, I'm not sure what the racer guys are doing though. They tend to keep the weight down and keep it simple I would guess.
I have an idea to get close to 2 times the hp they are getting now, the bad part is lots of things would need to be changed to do it. You mentioned materials, I fully agree. Yeah it would cost some big $ to extract some big HP.
For got to mention that big problem out front the big fan. So how do you get around the effciency problems there? If you make the HP how do you put it to good use?
As far as EFI and all that fun electronic stuff, yeah its nice when its working right. I know of many cases where the good old carb does as good or better. Turbo's over mechanical blowers? A radial needs that impeller to help distribute fuel air, a turbo will negate the power demand of the blower and its been done already in large recip aircraft, I'm not sure what the racer guys are doing though. They tend to keep the weight down and keep it simple I would guess.
I have an idea to get close to 2 times the hp they are getting now, the bad part is lots of things would need to be changed to do it. You mentioned materials, I fully agree. Yeah it would cost some big $ to extract some big HP.
For got to mention that big problem out front the big fan. So how do you get around the effciency problems there? If you make the HP how do you put it to good use?
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FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Never set limits on something that really has none . It just makes men strive harder !
Looking into building a plane . Cost is huge , but will do it over long term . Will keep you posted on findings
I wait with baited breath.
- Thread starter
- #31
N4521U
Colonel
Flyboy, isn't water injection known as ADI? Anti detonation injection, to keep the piston and cylinder walls cool? I did the nose art on Merlins Magic and Stus' T6 with the Tasmanian devil, as well as John Crockers race 6 when it waas sponsored by Ramada Reno. cheers, Bill
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Colin1
Senior Master Sergeant
What's the weight of a MiG-15 airframe, esp wrt the swept wings, as compared to a typical WWII recip airframe?
Assuming your project engine is going up front, you're almost certainly going to have to resolve the nosewheel issue wrt the engine needing some space. I'm also assuming your engine is a radial or you're going to need lumps and bumps sticking out of a previously clean airframe to provide your cooling and air intake.
I can't see it being a pusher prop unless you change the ground clearance (more weight) and even if you did, you might have weight distribution/c of g issues.
A MiG-15 airframe might be proven to 600mph but I bet it wasn't with a recip.
Why is your heart set on a Fw190 airframe?
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
Can't fly swept wing aircraft at Reno - RARA Rules.
It is and as far as what its called it depends on the operator - seen your art work - very cool!!
You're right Colin - MiG-15 airframes could be had but you're looking at some major redesign to put anything but a turbine engine on it. The "beefier" part of the MiG-15 is the engine bay behind the pilot, I know this from experience. Additionally I don't see a MiG-15 at 200' going 600 mph with a recip and prop pushing it along, if it could be done, as a matter of fact a "stock" MiG-15 will probably not make 600 mph on the Reno course . Again if one analyzed the airframe of a MiG-15 you would find many issues that would come up - in the end you're better off building a racer from the ground up.
MiG-15s are petty light considering, about 8000 lbs empty.
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- Thread starter
- #35
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
No afterburners, no composite propulsion system, can't race the same plane in more than one class, in my class (the jet class) you can't run more than 103% RPM - that's all I could think of right now.
I don't think you you could run a turbo prop in any class.
Your airplane also needs an experimental airworthiness certificate prior to race day. You cannot do any "experimenting" that constitutes a major alteration during race week.
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