Me 109 G vs Macchi 205 N Orione

Imagine an all red Macchi 205 Ferrari - powered racer!


That would be cool!

Good stuff, that is really cool with the Ferrari engine!

You're sure thats not a modern engine Parmigiano ? Like from the 80's or something like that ? The reason I'm asking is the Carbon fiber.

I tried to research that one but did not find anything.

Well I can tell you this much, Carbon fiber wasn't invented before the 60's. And although I'm not 100% sure about this, it wasn't used on engines before the 80's.

Does anyone know what the N-1, N-2 and the C.206 varients were to be powered by?

OK guys, was not clear enough it was a joke?!

Even with Mr Cazolari/Schumacher as a test driver?

I think the bw photo is from the 312T formula1, while the color photo I don't know.

Ferrari firm was established in 1947, the first Ferrari engine (1950) was a 12V but only 1,5 litre!

I wanted also to provide the draft of a racing-red 205 with an air scoop and aileron behind the cockpit,but I am too clumsy with the software...

Although Enzo Ferrari had a little to do with aviation: in the 1930's his firm (Auto Avio Costruzioni) was producing subcomponents for aviation, and the Ferrari symbol of the jumping horse was given to him by the widow of the WW1 italian ace Francesco Baracca (they were family friends)

... Back to real history..

In brief, the lineage of Macchi's was

MC 202 'Folgore'
Improved Mc200 frame with DB601 engine

MC205 V 'Veltro'
Stopgap solution: Mc202 frame fitted with DB605 engine. After a few produced with only 2x12.7 on cowling and 2x7.7 in the wings, the wing was modified to accomodate 2xMG151/20. (officially the MG were standardized on the Series III that was delivered in June 43, but many units of the series I were already carrying the 20mm cannons)

Production was about 180 aircraft before the armistice, plus another 100 in the Salò republic under German control.
Several MC202 that needed an engine change were refitted with DB605 in 1943-44, they were known with the nickname 'Folgeltro', adding confusion to confusion. This machines retained the 202 armament of 2x12.7

The structural difference between Mc200, 202 and 205V was really small, no more than the differences between Spit I - V- IX or 109E-F-G, so it was basically an evolution of the base Mc200 design.
Was common practice to repair the 205 cannibalizing spares from older 200 and 202 frames

MC205N 'Orione'
This was Castoldi's definitive design for the DB605 engine, redesigned with a larger wingspan (wing area 19sqm instead of 16,8).
It should have addressed the drop in maneuvrability of the 205V above 8500 mt
Also featuring an additional MG151/20 firing trough the hub, 109 like.
The difference between N1 and N2 was only the armament : the N1 had an engine mounted MG151, 2x12.7 in the cowling and 2x12.7 in the wing bays, the N2 replaced the 12.7 with the MG151 in the wings.

Only 2 prototypes completed

MC206
Interim design for a new 'high ceiling' fighter: was basically an enlarged MC205N airframe fitted with DB605 and redesigned wings, wing area was 21sqm and armament was 4xMG151 in the wings (Typhoon like)
No completed aircraft known, doubtful if a prototype was partially built.

MC207
The final design: MC206 airframe with DB603 engine
Only design.

OK guys, was not clear enough it was a joke?!


Well.......uh...........

Parmigiano said:

OK guys, was not clear enough it was a joke?!

Click to expand...

I had a feeling it was something like that !

Not bad!

thx to you all for the info

The mc205 has complete superiority by a long shot. Even though both fighters had the same engine, the mc 205 had many other qualities that gave it superiority. The Mc 205 had wide landing gear like the fw 190, it had very good cokcpit visibility, was more maneuverable and had better handling and a better dive.

There where two variants of the Mc 205: the V and the N. The mc 205v was essentially a mc 202 with the DB 605 engine and increase armament of two 12.7mm guns and two 20mm cannons. The mc 205n was an mc 205v with an improved design that attempted to increase the fighter's performance. The N also have an increased armament of either 4 x 12.7mm guns and a 20mm cannon in the N-1 or 2 x 12.7mm guns and 3 x 20mm guns in the N-2.
Pefomance was not really improved in the mc 205N: top speed was 390mph at 22,965ft to the mc 205v's top speed of 399mph at 23,620ft (keep in mind that the mc 205N was heavier due to the increased armament).

When you compare the fighter to the Bf 109G, the mc 205 was basically superior to it in almost every way, not only in performance, but also in other qualities such as excellent handling, wide landing gear and a better armament (although the BF 109G can carry the same armament as the mc 205n, it would need to carry gun pods under the wings which reduce maneuverability and rate of roll). The only Bf 109 that would have a chance against a Mc 205 would be the Bf 109G-10, K, and possibly the G-14/AS. One simple way of showing how the Mc 205 was superior to the Bf 109G was how it was an overall improvement of the Mc 202, unlike the Bf 109G that lost some of the excellent qualities of the Bf 109F.