P-40 Esoterica, a question for the true experts.

[newst]

I am in the process of converting an Airfix P-40B into an original P-40, what in later years has been called a P-40-CU to separate it from the early B models, even though these aircraft were contracted for before the Air Corps started using designator suffixes.

The subject of my efforts is 39-184, an aircraft assigned to Luke Army Airfield, Arizona shortly after Pearl Harbor for use as an advanced pursuit trainer. This aircraft was made mildly famous by Life magazine as it was given pride of place in a photo spread about Luke field published in 1942, including a number of color, in-flight photos. The aircraft was lost to an in flight engine fire later in 1942 but as there are no casualties identified in the strike from record documentation I assume that the pilot jumped to safety.

My question is whether these early P-40s were issued with shoulder belts, or were retrofitted with them. They were purchased at the time the USAAC was beginning to introduce them, but I don't know. My current position is to assume the belts were provided, either in production or as a retrofit, but if someone knows better I would like to hear from you.

Thanks,

Steve

 

[fubar57]

This is a drawing of the P-36A seat showing shoulder harness. Being the little brother of the P-40, I'm thinking shoulder harness as well

 

[newst]

This is a drawing of the P-36 seat showing shoulder harness. Being the little brother of the P-40, I'm thinking should harness as well

View attachment 476585​

Thanks,

I know that later P-36 models had the shoulder harness. Particularly those sold for export. That's why my default setting is to install them in the P-40.

 

[Elvis]

A pic from the Ace Pilots website shows the very plane newst is asking about......

...that light coloured "thing" is the parachute I think. Like the first pic (with the T-6), it appears the pilot is not wearing a shoulder strap....of course, that doesn't mean one wasn't present.
Anyway, better angle of the cockpit..



Elvis

 

[Airframes]

Yep, I enlarged the pic, and can't see the shoulder harness, just the parachute harness.

 

[newst]

Thank you all. I am currently going to leave the shoulder harness off. Of course, for as much time as this build is taking there will be many opportunities to change my mind, likely several times.

 

[waroff]

On P40, P40B, C & G, the shoulder straps were added to safety belt type B11 in june 1942(T.O. No 01-25c-94, 24 jun 1942)
There was no provision to fit shoulder strap on P36/H75.
Some french Hawk had US safety belt type B10 remplaced by a french harness(Aviorex 32 or Berger 505) which had shoulder strap so the backrest had a slot at the top.

 

[newst]

Thank you very much. This particular aircraft was lost to an in-flight engine fire on May 23, 1943 so it most likely did have a shoulder harness installed.

 

[daveT]

P-40, 39-184 has an interesting history. It was involved in 5 documented accidents. These reports are available from AAIR
http://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/dbasn.asp?SN=39-184&Submit4=Go

410411 P-40 39-184 35PI 8PI Mitchel Field, NY TAC 3 Lydon, Lenord C. USA IN Evansville, IN
430522 RP-40 39-184 544 SEFTS Luke Field, AZ FLEF/F 5 Lieto, Dominick J USA AZ Luke Field, AZ
420321 P-40A 39-184 56PS 54PG Harding Field, Baton Rouge, LA TOAGL 3 Paris, Ferdinand B USA LA Harding Field, LA
420424 P-40 39-184 56PS 54PG Harding Field, Baton Rouge, LA LACNU 3 Wood, Don B. M. USA LA Harding Field, LA
420825 P-40 39-184 66ABSq Luke Field, Phoenix, AZ LACGL 3 Kraus, Russell B USA AZ Luke Field, AZ

I would love to see more photos of the aircraft

 

[newst]

A few more. Years ago there was a two-part series on this aircraft published in the Wings & Airpower magazines that displayed the Life magazine WWII photo essay images. Over the years and moves my copies of the magazines have been lost but I still have these scanned images.

 

[Wurger]

 

[MIflyer]

Don't forget that the rear end of the belly fairing was actually a vent of some kind, as you can see on this B model. The P-40E had this too, and I assume that the later models did as well.

 

[Elvis]

Don't forget that the rear end of the belly fairing was actually a vent of some kind, as you can see on this B model. The P-40E had this too, and I assume that the later models did as well.

View attachment 489860

I may have something on that, but it will cost you $119 to find out.
Check it out -> Curtiss P-40 Kittyhawk - Blueprints, Aircraft Manuals and Data. [FP_P40] - $119.00 : PLANS.AERO™
...but if I had to guess, I'd say it was a pressure vent to help feed fresh air to the carb.


Elvis

 

[MIflyer]

Probably more likely to be a cockpit air vent. There are also vents in the center fairing on the belly.

Don't; forget the cowl flaps, either. They should be open on the ground - and it would be tricky to do that. Note what very probably is the fresh air intake to the cockpit in the wing root.

The P-40E has the same rear vent but this one has a tube sticking out of it, too. Probably some kind of oil vent. On my airplane the oil vent sticks out of the bottom of the cowling.

 

[Elvis]

In my search, I saw a blueprint that showed two round ports behind that vent that are supposed to be camera view ports for recon missions.

 

[Dana Bell]

Hi Steve,

There are quite a few differences between the P-40 and the P-40B/C/G. In addition, your aircraft has the extended tail wheel/enlarged tail wheel opening/redesigned tail wheel door that was added in service.

I wrote the follow to cover the many changes for modelers:

Amazon product ASIN 0985714948View: https://www.amazon.com/Aircraft-Pictorial-No-P-40-Warhawk/dp/0985714948/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1523810209&sr=8-1&keywords=dana+bell+p-40


You don't need to buy one - just borrow a copy from a friend. (Just don't download it from one of those cursed copyright-violating "free book" sites!)

Cheers,


Dana

 

[MIflyer]

"....camera view ports for recon missions."

Which would make the vent a particularly unfortunate location for oil or fuel drains. Or the pilot's relief tube drain. Admittedly, I suspect the P-40E's drain line there was a restoration add on.

 

[waroff]

I agree that keel fairing was opened at the end. The design of the keel fairing is same on all P40 family
the fuel vent outlet was under the port rear wing fillet, near the trailing edge.
The little fairing in drop shape was the outlets of drain battery, hydraulic tank and relief tube

 

[MIflyer]

It is interesting to see how the rear of the keel fairing, that is open at the rear end, nests into the forward fairing. I presume that is so they can remove the rear section without removing the larger forward portion, but they way they put one up inside the other is interesting.

 

[newst]

Hi Steve,

There are quite a few differences between the P-40 and the P-40B/C/G. In addition, your aircraft has the extended tail wheel/enlarged tail wheel opening/redesigned tail wheel door that was added in service.

I wrote the follow to cover the many changes for modelers:

Amazon product ASIN 0985714948View: https://www.amazon.com/Aircraft-Pictorial-No-P-40-Warhawk/dp/0985714948/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1523810209&sr=8-1&keywords=dana+bell+p-40


You don't need to buy one - just borrow a copy from a friend. (Just don't download it from one of those cursed copyright-violating "free book" sites!)

Cheers,


Dana

Thanks Dana,

I don't even need to borrow one, I already own a copy.

I want to thank everyone who has contributed to this project. There really is a vast amount of knowledge about the early Hawks that has been lost, or just scattered, and there are many who would like to know more. I will share this document that I downloaded from the internet years ago that covers many of the detail differences. I can't find it online anymore, and I can't confirm the accuracy of any of the data, but I always found it interesting.