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DerAdlerIstGelandet said:Very well put FBJ.
The YF-12A was cancelled because of mission complexity and overall cost. As described by an A12 CIA pilot who was carried over to the SR71 programme in his book, Blackbird (to paraphrase), "...the problem with the YF-12 interceptor was that every Blackbird mission required the support of a NASA ground station identical to that used in its space launches. In all respects flying the Blackbird is far more like a space mission than flying an aircraft."They YF-12 was canceled because there simply wasn't a threat for it to intercept. It was impractical but did assist in the development of the Phoenix missile system. The F-15 was developed under a whole different military doctrine nearly a decade later. The USAF didn't go with the F-15 in lieu of the YF-12, that's plain nonsense!!!
But not when it was intially developed. It was the single most expensive front line fighter of its day.The F-15 will turn out to be one of the most cost effective weapons platforms when it is finally retired.
I think it's fun dispelling comic book misconceptions.NOW THAT'S A JOKE! Are you sure you don't mean the SU-27???? The Mig-31 has a big powerful radar that could still be jammed, flies real fast and carries BIG missiles. BIG DEAL! Other than that it's a pig! It's still built out of steel, it cannot maneuver out of it's own way, has a 600 hour engine, drinks fuel like a whale, has a turning radius comparible to an SR-71 and is (was) a logistical nightmare. There was no big secret during it's development. Why do you think the Russians and other former USSR nations have gotten rid of their MiG-31s? It's a brick with wings! I think just about any modern western fighter (F-15, F-16, Tornado, F-18 ) if deployed properly, will feast on the Mig-31 without mercy!
I'm unclear as to what you're saying there. The XB70 was never proposed as a transport/renonnaissance in an attempt to resurrect the programme, Lockheed started on an SST...There was never any intensions to use the XB-70 as a transport. Lockheed started on a SST and TRADED most of that technology to Boeing for "S" duct technology used on the B727 and later on the Lockheed L1011. Boeing cancelled their SST program as government support dwindled. I know this for a fact cause I worked at Lockheed with people who worked on the YF-12A and were involved in this technology swap....
This sounds more like "I don't like your posts" to me. Pointless how? The two or three occasions where MiG Foxbats have ever been in battle (Syria, Saudi and initially, Iraq), were short lived, they were in very small numbers, were early variants (150hr engine life R15-B300 Tumanskys), pilots therefore had low familiarity, accompanying aircraft had been detuned (export MiG 23 variants, MiG 21 radar and weapons fitted), and they were hopelessly outnumbered. Using them for your "well considered appraisal" is far more pointless.Again these points are pointless - the Foxbat has been beaten in battle on numerous occasions and only ONE MiG-25 kill has ever been confirmed aganist a western fighter - A Mig-25 shot down an F-18 over Serbia, the F-18 pilot survived....
The MiG Foxbat has a supersonic g rating of 4.5g's. Aphids were excellent missiles of the 1960 and 70's. As were Sparrows and Sidewinders. I'm not big on the R-40's myself but apparently they're fairly comparable to the Sparrows of the day but with a better range spread and a nice, big warhead. R-73's are apparently as good as later Sidewinders. R-23's are as good as later Sparrows with their proximity fuse and a slightly heavier yeild.Your numbers on the Foxbat must have come from a sales brosure. Even if the Mig-25 is flown at Mach 2.8, it has to be able to maneuver, it will slow down. Hang those lumbering "Aphid" missles on the machine and it turns into a brick
The "soviets figured out the aircraft was just a pig" is not mentioned in any credible source I've ever read. This kind of appraisal appears markedly counter to any credible Soviet or technically knowledgable appraisal of the Foxbat/Foxhound series with which I'm familiar.FLYBOYJ said:DerAdlerIstGelandet said:Very well put FBJ.
Thanks Adler!
Another point - In the last years of the USSR the VVS actually removed the MiG-25 from frontal aviation interceptor squadrons and replaced them with MiG-23s and MiG-29s - why? Cause they cost too much money to maintain and operate and the Soviets figured out the aircraft was a pig! The MiG-31 was an attempt to give life to a dated design, but again it just wound up in a swine pen! The Chinese allegedly bought 24 of them with the plan of building 700 under license - this was supposed to start around 1999. This never materialized, I wonder why?!?
Although the MiG-31 carries a cannon, it could only maneuver at 5.5 Gs. What do you think an F-16 could do to it?!?
The last MiG-31s are expected to retire by 2010, if not sooner.
vanir said:"Pig, brick, would get feasted on by F15/16/14/etc." is just ignorant comic book patriotism. You're the one who sounds like a brochure, the hard-sell kind with a heavy dose of redneck.
vanir said:"The MiG 25 has throttle problems with overspeeding over Mach 2.6, this is inherent to the design of its turbojets. The airframe is rated to Mach 2.82 with a full load of four underwing bombs, a performance which it has demonstrated. It is also anecdotally exampled to have flown at speeds exceeding Mach 3 on numerous occasions, however in each case the engines were destroyed (these speeds were as a result of engine overspeed or "runaway rpm"), which the Foxbat was prone to without precise throttle control at high Mach speeds.
vanir said:The airframe of the MiG 31 is 50% high temp. nickle steel, 16% titanium and 33% indeterminent light alloys.
vanir said:All MiG 25s (including the MP Foxhound or MiG 31), were designed for high manoeuvrability and overall rigidity at high Mach speeds.
vanir said:As an airframe/technology combination the Foxhound is 10 yrs, not 40yrs old.
vanir said:The tiny number the Chinese bought, the only people outside the Russian Federation who operated them, were early build Foxhound A models, the MiG-25MP (MiG-31), a completely different animal to the MiG-31M which has an improved airframe. Around 160 were built. Without the Russian financial troubles it has been speculated (anecdotal), nobody outside their own air forces would have been given any but they have all been offered for export, under quite a bit of sales promotion since about 2000.
vanir said:You don't like these MiGs at all. I appreciate them. You like the XB70, I think it was a high school science project.
I don't think we're really going to get along on any of this.
DerAdlerIstGelandet said:Very well said FBJ! And yes vanir you need to back off with the insults. We have had eneogh problems with this kind of stuff and dont need it anymore.