"All of Vlad's forces and all of Vlad's men, are out to put Humpty together again." (6 Viewers)

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WARSPITER said:
Ukraine doesn't have enough to force major confrontation as they need backup inventory to carry anything through.....by the time Ukraine is ready to hit hard Russia will be down to dregs.
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Is there a risk that Ukraine waits too long for the ideal condition of their reserves, inventory and kit, to the point where the impatient West begins to wonder what their champion is waiting for? I wonder if Ukraine's self proclaimed "spring offensive" will in actuality be the "autumn" or "winter" offensive.
 
GrauGeist said:
Though several Eastern European countries are considering it.

I can only imagine the conversations going on behind the curtain, trying to persuade them not to, for obvious reasons - but that these countries are willing and itching to do it, speaks volumes.
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The context of his post was about direct American intervention.
 
Escuadrilla Azul said:
A question for our US forum members.

I notice that some perfectly reasonable and funcional US members see the support for Ukrainia as a path that the US (and the west) should not go and this war is not our business at all. And I'm not talking about the prototipical lurking troll but members that are very active and noticiable.

Is there any 'new isolationism' trend going in the US?

Mods, if this post is deemed too political, feel free to delete it, of course.
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Isolationists are in the minority here in Tejas ... but they're definitely present.

Further to your question, this article appeared at The Hill this morning. Quoted in part:

Five House Republican-backed initiatives to curtail aid to Ukraine using the annual Pentagon policy bill were shot down Thursday afternoon in votes that saw a consensus from both sides of the aisle to keep money flowing to Kyiv.

The Ukraine-related amendments to the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) would have effectively limited or rolled back U.S. involvement in Ukraine, but a majority of Republicans joined Democrats in opposition to the proposals.


My takeaway is that the media is ginning up the isolationist movement in order to garner clicks.
 
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WARSPITER said:
In answer to this there are those here in Australia saying the same things as well.

The majority here is all for giving as much help to Ukraine as possible but some are saying it isn't our business
as we have homelessness on the rise and other problems here (which is true but always ongoing). They are
generally sure they are right but it isn't really isolationist - rather more emotive.

I try to tell them that there is a bigger picture here as what Ukraine is going through can spread if we don't
help to stop it. There is a threat more direct to us in this context and we have to work against that.

I also ask them to consider the innocent victims in Ukraine and how many of them have nothing as they are now
homeless. The other argument is that the cost of helping in material terms to Australia is very low but the long
term stakes are very high.

If anyone tries to say it is still only a local problem between Ukraine and Russia it is worth pointing out the Russian
financed 'operations' going on in African countries right now (Wagner group in Central African Republic (CAR), Libya, Mali, and Sudan).
Many people don't know this but have seen the results on the news.

Finally, I point out the rise of Asian economies since the dissolving of the Soviet Union's influence since the early nineties.
You can have one or the other.
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In my experience, it is much the same situation here in western Canada
 
WARSPITER said:
Hard to say but military advisers in other countries will be advising politicians to be patient and the media can then
go and do the proverbial.
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Take a flying fu leap at a rolling doughnut?
Thumpalumpacus said:
Isolationists are in the minority here in Tejas ... but they're definitely present.

Further to your question, this article appeared at The Hill this morning. Quoted in part:

Five House Republican-backed initiatives to curtail aid to Ukraine using the annual Pentagon policy bill were shot down Thursday afternoon in votes that saw a consensus from both sides of the aisle to keep money flowing to Kyiv.

The Ukraine-related amendments to the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) would have effectively limited or rolled back U.S. involvement in Ukraine, but a majority of Republicans joined Democrats in opposition to the proposals.


My takeaway is that the media is ginning up the isolationist movement in order to garner clicks.
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And the contrarians are just trying to be noticed.
Most of the babble against supporting Ukraine comes from the same folks pushing various conspiracy theories.
 
Thumpalumpacus said:
Isolationists are in the minority here in Tejas ... but they're definitely present.
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In GW1, GW2, Afghanistan, Iraq occupation, etc. I think there was some public and perhaps even servicepeople confusion as to what the fight was for. For what purpose, for example did over 7,000 U.S. troops die in Afghanistan's invasion and subsequent occupation? How is the USA, its NATO allies or Afghanistan better off today?

But Ukraine's war is in my lifetime the first "good war" where Western values and people are helping an ally to fight an evil, clearly discernable enemy whose defeat is both definable and achievable. And whose defeat will make the West stronger, more united and bring Ukraine firmly out of ex-Soviet corruption and into the light of the West. When this war is over Ukraine will be a leading economic power in Europe and as a NATO member able to do more than its share to stand up to Russia. That's why I support helping Ukraine to the bitter end, because it's achievable and hopefully good for the world order (a total geopolitical collapse of Russia and subsequent power vacuum may not be, so let's no ask for that).
 
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RogerdeLluria said:
Speaking of retired officers. I'm seriously wondering if this is actually a parody account.


View: https://twitter.com/RealScottRitter/status/1678734033566547970
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LOL - the second Russia tried this, and pushed into Estonia or Latvia or Lithuania, they'd trigger Article 5 and all the other NATO nations would very quickly take care of the invading forces. Who dreams up this kind of nonsense anyway? I spent decades as a defense analyst and thought I'd seen every improbable/impossible scenario, but apparently I missed a few!
 
OldGeezer said:
LOL - the second Russia tried this, and pushed into Estonia or Latvia or Lithuania, they'd trigger Article 5 and all the other NATO nations would very quickly take care of the invading forces. Who dreams up this kind of nonsense anyway? I spent decades as a defense analyst and thought I'd seen every improbable/impossible scenario, but apparently I missed a few!
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Have a look at the name of the person who posted it.
 
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