Allied Gold-Match II

[Sal Monella]

Soren gets credit first off as the "father" of this genre of post.

Ladies and gentlemen. In the left ring, whatever Spitfire you choose that became operational up through the conclusion of the year of our Lord, 1945.

In the right ring, whatever F8-F Bearcat you choose that became operational in the year of our Lord, 1945.

Air to air combat at 10,000, 20,000 and 30,000 feet.

May the best plane win and the loser endure a quick and painless death!


Sal Monella

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

when you say 1945 do you mean actually the whole year up to december 31st or up to the end of the second world war??

 

[Sal Monella]

I don't think the Bearcat saw combat. It is really sort of a post war aircraft so why don't we just round it out to December 31, 1945.

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

well then why not compare it to a fury??

but remember by the end of 1945 even later spits would have entered service...........

 

[DAVIDICUS]

I think the "Fury" was a biplane.

The first production Sea Fury didn't fly until mid to late 1946.

Which was the best model of the Spit that was operational by the end of '45?

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

well the prototype furies had flown by the end of the war..........

 

[DAVIDICUS]

"... that became operational up through the conclusion of the year of our Lord, 1945. "

Yeah, I'm sure he meant "operational as a prototype."

I'm obvioulsy inclined towards the F-8 (that powerplant makes by butt tingle) but will reserve judgment until a contender appears.

 

[pbfoot]

first fury flew on sept 1 44 prototype the 2n flew 27/11/44

 

[DAVIDICUS]

It wasn't operational in 1945.

From: http://www.unlimitedair.com/Hawker_Sea_Fury_History.htm

Early in 1944, a revised naval specification, N.22/43, supplanted N.7/43. and in April 1944 contracts were placed for 200 F.2/43 planes for the RAF and 200 N.22/43 planes for the Fleet Air Arm. The first Sea Fury prototype, SR661, flew on 21 February, 1945. It was powered by a Centaurus XII engine driving a four-bladed propeller. This airplane had a deck arrester hook under the rudder, but retained fixed wings. The second Sea Fury prototype, SR666, was powered by a Centaurus XV driving a five-bladed propeller and was a fully navalized aircraft with folding wings. The prototype Sea Fury SR661 was subsequently tested for its suitability as a naval fighter, and in deck landing trials, at the A&AEE Boscombe Down in May 1945. Tests were still underway as the Japanese surrendered in August 1945.

With the end of the Second World War, the RAF cancelled all production contracts for the Fury, deciding to concentrate all of its future efforts on jet fighters. The Royal Navy reduced its order for Sea Furies to 100 aircraft, and canceled the Boulton-Paul contract in its entirety.

The first production aircraft - a Mark 10 which was a carrier-based version, with folding wings- did not make its initial flight until September 1946. Although originally intended to serve with both the RAF and FAA, the RAF order was cancelled at the end of the war. The first deck trials with Sea Fury TF898 began aboard HMS Victorious during the winter of 1946-47. The Mark 10 was approved for carrier operations in Spring 1947, and five Fleet Air Arm squadrons were then equipped with the Sea Fury. The Mark 10 was followed by the Mark 11 fighter-bomber - 615 of these were eventually delivered to the Navy. It became the Fleet Air Arm's principal single-seat fighter and remained so until the introduction of the Sea Hawk jet fighter in 1953.

 

[pbfoot]

in january 45 the contract had already been halved as the raf decided on the jet option in jan 45 tested deck landings with vampire hence the low proirity of sea fury

 

[Nonskimmer]

The Sea Fury served the RCN and RAN well too, in the post-war years. I've always loved that plane.

 

[Sal Monella]

Will none of you chivalristic Brits stand up for the Spitfire's honor?

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

well yeah of course i'm with the spit.........

 

[mosquitoman]

If the Spit got the Bearcat into a turning dogfight the Bearcat would be dead meat

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

and the spit had better armourment..........

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

assuming the F8F had .50cals of course.............

 

[Soren]

Give me a Spit XXI or beyond, and in a dogfight I will blow any other piston engined fighter out of the sky !

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

and some jets too.........

 

[mosquitoman]

Exactly, either get height and speed or get into a turning dogfight.

 

[Anonymous]

LOL - the Spitfire would be murdered by the Bearcat.

The Bearcat made 20k in 4.7 minutes at 59 inches of boost using the R-2800-22W (B series) engine. This gave an initail rate of climb of about 4570 fpm. This is the plane that all the typical stats for the F8F-1 erroneously come from.

The production F8F used the more powerful R-2800-34W (C series) engine, which was capable of up to 70 inches of boost, just like that in the F4U-4. It was capable of a 6000+ fpm climb and a top speed of around 445 mph. The later -2 model had an improved cowl design allowing 6400 fpm climb and 455 mph top speed.

As far as the Spit XIV outmanuvering the Bearcat - there is just no way. In 1943 the British tested the Spit V against the Hellcat and found them to be comprable in turn performance. The Spit V turned quite a bit better than the Spit XIV, where the F8F turned substantially better than the F6F. Therefore, the F8F would turn very much better than the Spit XIV.

The only place the Spit XIV would have an advantage would be at very high altitude. Below 30K or so it would be no contest.

=S=

Lunatic