Ar 234

[kitplane01]

Suppose the Ar 234 had come in Jan 1944, in useful numbers. And production had ramped up from there. Suppose Germany had the fuel and crew and safe bases and other stuff to operate the Ar 234 to best advantage.

How well would it have done?

The Allies also have smart people, and would have worked hard to defeat this threat. It carries a small bomb load. But the Allies found many uses for the Mosquito .. how best would Germany have used the Ar 234 and how effective would it have been and would it have been safe over UK skies?


(I'm not asking if that changes the winner of the war, because I'm not 12).

 

[kitplane01]

My attempt at an answer ...

Recon is a very obvious use. The allies have no intercepter that can catch a single bomber. Using a city-full of flak to shoot one bomber is not cost efficient and unlikely to work anyway.

Point bombing ... anyone know how accurate a bomber from 30,000 ft and 500 mph can be. The pilot is also the bombardier. This seems unlikely.

Area bombing ... The Ar 234 has a very small payload so it will take many attacks to have a large effect. If the Allies cannot shoot you down, you can repeat over and over. A few hundred Ar 234s hitting London every night will eventually be noticed.

Annoyance bombing ... Have a few raiders over London every night. Keep the city in the bomb shelters with the light off .. every night. Also Manchester, because I've been to Manchester.

Anti-ship ... If the Ar 234 could lift a Fritz-X, and the single pilot could both fly his own plane and remote control the missile, that would be very potent. Sounds difficult, but you get to pick the very best pilots for this mission.

Low level raiders ... Fly at treetop level, unexpecdidly hit a pinpoint target, and run. Good way to attack an individual ship or factory or port. But is an Ar 234 faster than a Spitfire at treetop level?

 

[gjs238]

Well, how does Ar234 performance compare to the Gloster Meteor, which by happenstance also sees its development and deployment moved forward and could be seen swarming the sky?

 

[Shortround6]

Anti-ship ... If the Ar 234 could lift a Fritz-X, and the single pilot could both fly his own plane and remote control the missile, that would be very potent. Sounds difficult, but you get to pick the very best pilots for this mission.

We are getting a little too far out on the "What if" path. Trying to fly and guide the missile at the same time is a lot closer to to patting your head and rubbing your stomach while jumping hurdles at the same time than walking and chewing gum. granted an auto pilot can help control the plane but that and the need to keep the missile in view means a steady, non evasive flight path. Keeping the missile in view also means slowing waaaaay down from normal jet speeds so the controlling plane stays pretty much over the missle.
They were working on other guidance systems but now we are talking not only about Ar 234s in gretter numbers, but fitting a Fritz-X under belly (longer landing gear?) or under one wing root? AND a whole new guidance system, working on such a system does not mean they were only a few months away from deploying it. Bothe Germans and the Allies were working on the basic concepts for a number of guidance systems. Many of them did become operational but not until many years after the war, some not until after the Korean war.

 

[fubar57]

Got into the "What if" path on Post #1

 

[Shortround6]

Low level raiders ... Fly at treetop level, unexpecdidly hit a pinpoint target, and run. Good way to attack an individual ship or factory or port. But is an Ar 234 faster than a Spitfire at treetop level?

Doesn't matter what the Spitfire can do. Jets, especially early jets, had miserable range at low altitude.
For example the US P-80A with 470 gallons (no drop tanks) was good for about 500 miles range at 10,000ft in max range condition/power settings. 625 miles at 20,000ft and 800 miles at 30,000ft. The flight manual doesn't give ranges at lower altitudes.

 

[GrauGeist]

*IF* you want to have an impact with the Ar234, start off by convincing Hitler that THIS is the Schnellbomber he's looking for, not the Me262.
That in turn, would allow the Me262's production to proceed unhindered.

The Ar234 was best used as a tactical bomber, however it appears that it's speed was an issue the pilots were not experienced with, so they did not have the accuracy needed for such a role.
An example would be the missions flown against the Ludendorf bridge at Remagen.

 

[Denniss]

If you have the Ar 234 by January 1944 then you'll also have the engines for mass-producing the Me 262.
Me 262 was not delayed by adding bomb shackles, it was the lack of engine production.

 

[GrauGeist]

The focus on producing the A2-a meant fewer A1-a Airframes built, regardless of engines on hand.

 

[kitplane01]

My question really was, what's the best way to use the Ar 234 if you had a bunch and they worked well.

 

[kitplane01]

Doesn't matter what the Spitfire can do. Jets, especially early jets, had miserable range at low altitude.
For example the US P-80A with 470 gallons (no drop tanks) was good for about 500 miles range at 10,000ft in max range condition/power settings. 625 miles at 20,000ft and 800 miles at 30,000ft. The flight manual doesn't give ranges at lower altitudes.

True.

I rather imagined a hi-low-hi attack, not a low-low-low attack.

The Ar 234 does not have divebrakes, but otherwise hi-low-hi seems like a good strategy.

 

[Koopernic]

My attempt at an answer ...

Recon is a very obvious use. The allies have no intercepter that can catch a single bomber. Using a city-full of flak to shoot one bomber is not cost efficient and unlikely to work anyway.

Point bombing ... anyone know how accurate a bomber from 30,000 ft and 500 mph can be. The pilot is also the bombardier. This seems unlikely.

Area bombing ... The Ar 234 has a very small payload so it will take many attacks to have a large effect. If the Allies cannot shoot you down, you can repeat over and over. A few hundred Ar 234s hitting London every night will eventually be noticed.

Annoyance bombing ... Have a few raiders over London every night. Keep the city in the bomb shelters with the light off .. every night. Also Manchester, because I've been to Manchester.

Anti-ship ... If the Ar 234 could lift a Fritz-X, and the single pilot could both fly his own plane and remote control the missile, that would be very potent. Sounds difficult, but you get to pick the very best pilots for this mission.

Low level raiders ... Fly at treetop level, unexpecdidly hit a pinpoint target, and run. Good way to attack an individual ship or factory or port. But is an Ar 234 faster than a Spitfire at treetop level?

There were three Ar 234 models delivered to the Luftwaffe:
1 Ar 234A with a takeoff trolley and landing skid purely for reconnaissance. Its first mission was photographing the allied landings at Normandy, the first Luftwaffe Reconnaissance aircraft to have successfully done so.
2 Ar 234B which had a normal undercarriage but due to the thickening of the fueselage lost 16mph speed.
3 Ar 234C which replaced the 2 x Jumo 004B engines with 4 x BMW 003A engines. I think 5 were delivered. This was a much faster aircraft, could haul bombs at very high speed and didn't require RATO when confronted by heavy loads on short runways. This left the RATO attachment points free for drop fuel tanks. The Ar 234C was also pressurised and the cabin could accommodate 2 crew though this was not yet configured and it had 20mm forward firing gun armament as standard. The second crew member would have dramatically improved bomb aiming and navigation. It was also the basis for a night fighter variant. The Payload of this model was significant About 3300lbs. (yes it could lift a Fritz-X and it was planned)

By far the most important contribution of the Me 262 and Ar 234 would have been reconnaissance. It took 2 weeks to transfer the Ar 234 from the flight test program to France and they provided the first photographs of the allied landings.

1 The Luftwaffe would have been able to get a reconnaissance photographs of the allied build-up for overlord even if they didn't fly over Britain, only along the coast. As it was Ar 234A did conduct successful missions over Britain.
2 At the commencement of the allied invasion suspicious Signals Intelligence and radar operators could have requested the despatch of Ar 234 or Me 262 to investigate. Pilot reports, photographs and photoflash bomb photography would have revealed the intent of the allied landings.
3 Actual photographs of the landings and invasion would have allowed planning of German counter attacks where it might have the most effect.

4 During the Fiesler Fi 103/V1 and A4/V2 attacks on Britain after the invasion reconnaissance was needed to asses the accuracy of hits, without photo reconnaissance the Germans relined on agent reports and these turned out to have been manipulated by British Intelligence. Typically an Arado 234 would have a camera with a timer or signal that would photograph at the instant of impact and post strike analysis was used to adjust the aim point of subsequent missiles. (Note the V2 had many advanced guidance systems under development including radar and optical tracking) and the V1 also had Ewald trackers on board of 5% of early launches but the Germans discounted their "Ewald" beacons and believed the faulty agents.

5 The 2 seat versions of the Ar 234 could have carried the Fritz-X, this was planed, I have drawing in a Eddie J Creek book, giving it a deadly accurate weapon in an aircraft almost immune from inteception.

7 During the actual invasion one of Adolf Hitlers hopes is that the Me 262 would be ready to penetrate allied fighter screens and attack the invasion fleet. I have my doubts about the Me 262's ability to do this due to the TSA 2D toss bombing sight not being ready till late 1944 for experimental evaluation (with KG7). Fw 190A with Revi sights and 500kg bombs, 20mm guns would have devastated the allied invasion fleet but for fighter screens but they struggled to get through the 12000 strong allied fighter force.

The Ar 234 however could carry the BZA computer bombsight normally associated with the Stuvi 5. The computing bombsight allows reasonably accurate shallow angle bombing and the Ar 234B was equipped with it. A 250kg or 500kg bomb with a 5 second delay tossed at a ship will destroy it and even if it hits the water and sinks it will likely break the ship in two as the time delay will detonate the bomb under the ship or landing aircraft.

8 The Luftwaffe did have several blind bombing systems in use at the end of the war. There was the Erstling IFF based EGON which used a transponder and a single Freya like radar, EGON-II which worked like Oboe and was almost as accurate and Zyklops a beam riding system (usually used in short ranged tactical attacks but quite long ranged) and finally the new IFF system called Neuling had blind bombing built in. A system called Nachtfee made jamming all but impossible but this required a second crew member.

Hence the Luftwaffe could have run a few squadrons and dropped some quite accurate bombs at night, maybe 50 aircraft could drop 100 or so bombs a night, or used them for target marking or dropping Schwann See radio marker bouys for other Luftwaffe aircraft to home on to.

9 The Ar 234 was proposed as a fighter, it was more manoeuvrable than the Me 262 and might have provided some air cover for the u-boats by harassing allied maritime patrol aircraft in and around convoys.

 

[Denniss]

The focus on producing the A2-a meant fewer A1-a Airframes built, regardless of engines on hand.

There was no difference in airframe, just in equipment needed or not for the mission task.

 

[Dimlee]

5 The 2 seat versions of the Ar 234 could have carried the Fritz-X, this was planed, I have drawing in a Eddie J Creek book, giving it a deadly accurate weapon in an aircraft almost immune from inteception.

But Ar 234 should slow down in order to steer the missile and due to the sensitivity of the engines, the deceleration should begin early enough. So in the most important period of the mission, Ar 234 is as vulnerable as piston engine Fritz-X carrier, isn't it.

 

[swampyankee]

But Ar 234 should slow down in order to steer the missile and due to the sensitivity of the engines, the deceleration should begin early enough. So in the most important period of the mission, Ar 234 is as vulnerable as piston engine Fritz-X carrier, isn't it.

And the radio link would be just as susceptible to jamming. Also, the Fritz-X will be hanging out in the breeze, slowing down the carrier aircraft by quite a bit

 

[Dimlee]

Just to add to the list of Koopernic.

10. Strategic reconnaissance at the Eastern Front. Subject LW can find a suitable replacement for Theodor Rowehl to manage. Such reconnaissance could assist in planning against Red Army's offenses in 1944.

11. Operation Eisenhammer in 1944. Until July-October, most of the original targets (except Gorky) were in the range of Ar 234 with at least one SC 500. Probably daylight raids would be possible.

 

[swampyankee]

Just to add to the list of Koopernic.

10. Strategic reconnaissance at the Eastern Front. Subject LW can find a suitable replacement for Theodor Rowehl to manage. Such reconnaissance could assist in planning against Red Army's offenses in 1944.

11. Operation Eisenhammer in 1944. Until July-October, most of the original targets (except Gorky) were in the range of Ar 234 with at least one SC 500. Probably daylight raids would be possible.

Recon would probably be far more important than the ordnance it could deliver.

 

[Thos9]

Target the British electricity industry.
Power stations are point targets, impossible to move or conceal and difficult to repair, especially if a number are damaged at the same time. Cooling towers are particularly vulnerable.
Shut the generators down and keep them down. Their output cannot be substituted or stored (except partly through hydro). Degrade the distribution system to magnify local effects.
Because civilian subsistence must have priority, shortages fall disproportionately on the war effort.

 

[swampyankee]

A lot of industrial targets are also hard, in that they must be hit directly -- even a 500 lb bomb detonating a few feet from heavy machinery will cause little lasting damage. While utility boilers tend to be barely sheltered, they also tend to be made up of a lot of pretty thick pieces of high-quality metal.

 

[Dimlee]

Recon would probably be far more important than the ordnance it could deliver.

Probably.
Still, Eisenhammer was a smart plan. Originally it was designed for Mistels. But BZA could provide higher accuracy and Ar 234 with its speed advantage could attempt daylight operation. Pilots of KG200 studied photos, pictures and models of their targets, so they knew where to hit. Could 3-4 500 kg bombs destroy or critically damage the turbines of one station? If they can, then the Soviet industry is shocked by shutdowns. Turbines were very difficult to replace and to repair.