Best mass produced postwar single engine piston fighter?

[Admiral Beez]

What is the best mass produced (for this thread we'll set that at over 500 units built) single-engine, piston-powered fighter that entered service between postwar 1945 and 1950. Contenders would include the Lavochkin La-9 and La-11, Hawker Sea Fury and Grumman F8F Bearcat (formally entered service during WW2, so some was argue to exclude).

 

[Glider]

I would argue that there isn't a best post WW2 piston engine fighter as they were all outclassed by any post war jet fighter.

 

[GrauGeist]

The F4U would be one to consider.

In Korea, a MiG-15 made the mistake of dogfighting a USMC F4U and was shot down.

 

[special ed]

D.H. Hornet

 

[Admiral Beez]

I would argue that there isn't a best post WW2 piston engine fighter as they were all outclassed by any post war jet fighter.

Then I'm led to suggest that this isn't the thread for you.

D.H. Hornet

I'm not sure I'd want to fight in a Hornet with only one engine.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Being unfamiliar with them, I had to look up the Soviet planes. They didn't strike me as very impressive. By the performance numbers, it'd appear to be the Bearcat (except the armament loadout), but that obviously doesn't consider some stats not mentioned in those wikis (roll-rate and turn-rate not mentioned for the Bearcat, especially). Other factors such as reliability and ease of maintenance are unknown to me, so I don't really have an informed opinion. As a guess, I'd go with the go the Bearcat. About equal speed, higher ceiling, inferior armament (corrected later by replacing the .50s with 4x20mm), superior range, better climb rate by a little -- but it's really too close for me to offer a solid opinion given my ignorance.

I've always thought the Sea Fury had beautiful lines, though.

Between those two, I bet it once more would come down to the pilot.

 

[MIflyer]

How do you define "best?" Do you mean highest performance or most useful?

The F-82 probably would have the highest performance. The A-1 likely would be the best design. The T-28 might well be the most useful.

 

[SaparotRob]

I'm going with "the best" was meant in our opinion. There's always a strong case for different planes. I went for cache'. Spitfire Mk XXIV. That did just miss WW 2, right?

 

[pbehn]

I'm going with "the best" was meant in our opinion. There's always a strong case for different planes. I went for cache'. Spitfire Mk XXIV. That did just miss WW 2, right?

I think they did away with Roman numerals when they hit 20, too difficult for the eccentric Brits to cope with.

 

[pbehn]

I would also say the post war Spits were the best fighters, but they werent carrier capable, between the Sea Fury and Bearcat I think they are so close it depends on which colour scheme you prefer.

 

[MIflyer]

Thing is, high speed meant almost nothing for a postwar prop fighter because there was always gonna be a faster jet, a much faster jet. 300 MPH was as good as 450 MPH, and in fact better because it was combined with longer range and heavier ordnance capability.

The Spitfire was a wonderful airplane but not very useful postwar given the near-impossibility of it's performing its traditional interceptor, air superiority, and photo recon roles as well as being not much good for ground attack. Postwar, you'd better off with some P-40N's than Spitfires, and lot better off with some P-51's and a hell of a lot better off with some F4U's or A-1's. The Spitfire was not very popular postwar, as is evidenced by its comparative scarcity today. Add in the fact that the magnesium alloy rivets it used created some serious maintenance problems and it's a small wonder that it did not last long.

 

[SaparotRob]

They still look cool.

 

[pbehn]

Thing is, high speed meant almost nothing for a postwar prop fighter because there was always gonna be a faster jet, a much faster jet. 300 MPH was as good as 450 MPH, and in fact better because it was combined with longer range and heavier ordnance capability.

The Spitfire was a wonderful airplane but not very useful postwar given the near-impossibility of it's performing its traditional interceptor, air superiority, and photo recon roles as well as being not much good for ground attack. Postwar, you'd better off with some P-40N's than Spitfires, and lot better off with some P-51's and a hell of a lot better off with some F4U's or A-1's. The Spitfire was not very popular postwar, as is evidenced by its comparative scarcity today. Add in the fact that the magnesium alloy rivets it used created some serious maintenance problems and it's a small wonder that it did not last long.

There are more Spitfires today than P-51s because more were made. All you have to do is find the manufacturers plate, find an engine or make one and rebuild it. Most are not airworthy and many may be in the channel or melted down to something else.

 

[nuuumannn]

Thing is, high speed meant almost nothing for a postwar prop fighter because there was always gonna be a faster jet, a much faster jet. 300 MPH was as good as 450 MPH, and in fact better because it was combined with longer range and heavier ordnance capability.

The Spitfire was a wonderful airplane but not very useful postwar given the near-impossibility of it's performing its traditional interceptor, air superiority, and photo recon roles as well as being not much good for ground attack. Postwar, you'd better off with some P-40N's than Spitfires, and lot better off with some P-51's and a hell of a lot better off with some F4U's or A-1's. The Spitfire was not very popular postwar, as is evidenced by its comparative scarcity today. Add in the fact that the magnesium alloy rivets it used created some serious maintenance problems and it's a small wonder that it did not last long.

Um, there's around 200 Spitfires surviving in loads of countries around the world. There are more Spitfire survivors than there are F4U Corsairs in museums and in airworthy condition around the world, so that kinda blows that out of the water.

List of surviving Vought F4U Corsairs - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

List of surviving Supermarine Spitfires - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

These wiki lists aren't entirely accurate, but the number of Spits surviving is higher. I can also confirm that in the bible for surviving warbirds, Geoff Goodall's Warbirds Directory, which is regularly updated, the Spitfire pages as recently as July 2021:

GEOFF GOODALL'S AVIATION HISTORY SITE - Warbirds Directory V6

The Spit saw extensive foreign usage post-war, including in the Middle East, where Egyptian and Israeli Spitfires battled it out against each other. The RAF retired the type as a weather recon aircraft in 1958, but the type operated in around 30 countries' air forces in total, the majority of which was post-war - apart from Australia and the United States (and the Luftwaffe by proxy) the Spitfire wasn't exported so much during WW2, although Commonwealth air forces had RAF squadrons. Nonetheless, we are looking at a larger number of total operators than the P-51 and the F4U, not to mention higher total production numbers than both those types.

 

[Shortround6]

Vought F4U-5 Corsair.

Gotta love the plane that was the only propeller aircraft in Korea to have it's pilot make Ace, and do it at night and be the only US navy ace regardless of aircraft.

Wonder what that pilot could have done with a jet

Guy Bordelon - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[GrauGeist]

We could also look at the prop fighters that were involved in conflicts post war to get an idea, too.
Granted, the Israeli Bf109s versus the Arab League Spitfires may not count, as the Bf109 ceased production in '45, though lived on a while longer through Avia and Hispano.
Same for the early Southeast Asia conducts that included abandoned Japanese types.

An example, from the late 60's no less, would be the "Football War" between Honduras and El Salvador that saw P-51s, F4Us (and FG-1s), AT-6s and T-28s pitted against each other.

 

[nuuumannn]

An example, from the late 60's no less, would be the "Football War" between Honduras and El Salvador that saw P-51s, F4Us (and FG-1s), AT-6s and T-28s pitted against each other.

This is fascinating stuff, and the accounts of the Football War out there vary considerably in terms of impact, from hardly any casualties to vast numbers dead.

Theres' an ex Honduran F4U-5 airworthy in Australia, the first on its civil register. don't have a photo yet, but it looks great in pictures.

VH-III | Chance Vought F4U-5NL Corsair | Private | Mach One Aeromedia | JetPhotos

Graham Hosking's Vought F4U-5 Corsair VH-III and Judy Pay's Curtiss P-40F Warhawk near their Tyabb home.. VH-III. Chance Vought F4U-5NL Corsair. JetPhotos.com is the biggest database of aviation photographs with over 5 million screened photos online!

www.jetphotos.com

 

[nuuumannn]

Granted, the Israeli Bf109s versus the Arab League Spitfires may not count, as the Bf109 ceased production in '45, though lived on a while longer through Avia and Hispano.

I'd include the Bf 109 offshoots without hesitation, both the Israelis and the Spaniards used their '109 descendants in combat, not to mention what was ranked as one of the largest private air forces in the world at the time, Hamish Mahaddie's Air Force, created for the filming of Battle of Britain, which relied heavily on ex-Ejercito del Aire Buchons, which Mahaddie bought from the Spaniards, although the CASA 2111 stand-ins were still in service with the Ejercito del Aire and were painted in Luftwaffe markings and repainted back into their original Spanish markings at the expense of the film budget.

This particular Buchon has been restored in its movie colours and for those who believe that it's 'inauthentic', it has actually spent a longer time as a Bf 109 stand-in than it ever did in military service with the Ejercito del Aire.

DSC_5492

 

[GrauGeist]

What surprised me, was the account of the FG-1 besting a P-51D in a drawn-out dogfight

 

[MIflyer]

There are more Spitfires on display somewhere because they got phased out earlier. They did not get used up because they were not good for much of anything in the jet era. Even in WWII the Spit was recognized as a lousy fighter bomber; they used them only because the RAF was so obcessed with the Air Defense of Great Britain that when Overlord came along they found they had nothing else. They even considered asking that the A-36 go back into production. The Typhoon looked good only because the Spit looked so much worse. The Aussies and NZ were well pleased with the P-40 in that role. In Burma they replaced the Hurricanes with P-47's, not Spitfires. How many Spitfires did they send to Korea?