Douglas Devastator
- Thread starter Bob W
- Start date
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The shot of the three U.S. Navy Douglas TBD-1 Devastators of Torpedo Squadron 2 (VT-2) is a well-known image. It was taken circa 1937-1939.
The three TBDs had much different careers:
TBD-1, BuNo 0292, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-9". The aircraft was lost on 12 January 1940 with VT-3 in a mid-air collision with TBD-1 BuNo 0373. The crew (Ens. Walter G. Barnes, Jr. P. E. Dickson, AMM2 C. W. Post, RM2) bailed out safely.
TBD-1, BuNo 0292, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-7" (section leader). It was later lost with VT-5 (as "5-T-7") when it crash-landed in the Jaluit Atoll lagoon, Marshall Islands, on 1 February 1942. The crew (Lt. Harlan T. Johnson (XO VT-5), Charles E. Fosha, ACMM, NAP, James W. Dalzell, RM1c) became prisoners of war. This aircraft was rediscovered, circa 1997 (location: N 5 58' 39" E 169 27' 6").
TBD-1, BuNo 0293, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-8". It was later lost with VT-8 (as "T-6") during the Battle of Midway on 4 June 1942. The crew (Ens. William W. Creamer, Francis S. Polston, SEA2c) was killed.
IMHO using of the pic doesn't mean that the plane type was used by the US Army at all. The envelope looks like a fancy one. It could be created for many reasons like sending an invitaion for an anniversary/establishment or commemorating of something. The propaganda is also possible.
The three TBDs had much different careers:
TBD-1, BuNo 0292, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-9". The aircraft was lost on 12 January 1940 with VT-3 in a mid-air collision with TBD-1 BuNo 0373. The crew (Ens. Walter G. Barnes, Jr. P. E. Dickson, AMM2 C. W. Post, RM2) bailed out safely.
TBD-1, BuNo 0292, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-7" (section leader). It was later lost with VT-5 (as "5-T-7") when it crash-landed in the Jaluit Atoll lagoon, Marshall Islands, on 1 February 1942. The crew (Lt. Harlan T. Johnson (XO VT-5), Charles E. Fosha, ACMM, NAP, James W. Dalzell, RM1c) became prisoners of war. This aircraft was rediscovered, circa 1997 (location: N 5 58' 39" E 169 27' 6").
TBD-1, BuNo 0293, was delivered to VT-2 as "2-T-8". It was later lost with VT-8 (as "T-6") during the Battle of Midway on 4 June 1942. The crew (Ens. William W. Creamer, Francis S. Polston, SEA2c) was killed.
IMHO using of the pic doesn't mean that the plane type was used by the US Army at all. The envelope looks like a fancy one. It could be created for many reasons like sending an invitaion for an anniversary/establishment or commemorating of something. The propaganda is also possible.
Shortround6
Lieutenant General
It does not appear so.
At the time the Devastators were being made in 1937-38, (they were old in 1942) The army was buying Northrop A-17s or A-17As. The army had no use for folding wings or torpedoes. The A-17s had four .30 cal guns for strafing, not a single gun. A-17s had racks/tubes for 20 30lb bombs inside the fuselage and racks for larger bombs outside.
Maybe they could have turned a TBD into an army attack plane but it needed a lot of modifications.
In 1938 the Army decided to buy only twin engine attack planes and didn't buy any more single engine attack or bombers until they ordered the A-24s (army Douglas SBDs) in 1941?
Flown by the Army in the Louisiana maneuvers of September 1941.
The Navy had already issued the requirement that lead to the Grumman TBF Avenger in early 1939.
Wurger has much better sources than I do, so absent any aircraft record cards by serial number saying otherwise it would seem that there were no TBDs sold/transferred to the army.
The USAAF eventually received 953 A-24, A-24A & A-24B aircraft. Most were used within the USA for training but some did see combat
pacificwrecks.com
The USAAF also acquired the SB2C Helldiver as the A-25A Shrike
And also the Vultee Vengeance in A-31 & A-35 forms
en.wikipedia.org
Neither of these types saw operation service with the USAAF after it lost interest in dive bombing. They did however provide useful service in secondary roles.
Pacific Wrecks - Pacific Wrecks - 531st Fighter-Bomber Squadron (531st FBS) / 531st Fighter Squadron (531st FS) U.S. Army Air Force (USAAF), 21st Fighter Group (21st FG), 7th Air Force (7th AF)
The 531st Fighter-Bomber Squadron (531st FBS) / 531st Fighter Squadron (531st FS) served in the Central Pacific during World War II.
The USAAF also acquired the SB2C Helldiver as the A-25A Shrike
And also the Vultee Vengeance in A-31 & A-35 forms
Vultee A-31 Vengeance - Wikipedia
Neither of these types saw operation service with the USAAF after it lost interest in dive bombing. They did however provide useful service in secondary roles.
Geoffrey Sinclair
Staff Sergeant
- 1,093
- Sep 30, 2021
The Douglas TBD Devastator was a USN type only.
Northrop A-17, 110 from November 1935 to January 1937 plus 2 A-17AS in August 1936 (Contract 7326 dated 1 March 1935), 100 A-17A from February to December 1937 (contract 8323 dated 29 January 1936), then 29 A-17A June to August 1938 (contract 8323 SA 8 dated 8 November 1937), the A-17 and A-17AS from Northrop, the A-17A from Douglas
Douglas TBD Devastator, 1 in June 1937, 113 from September 1937 to June 1938 (contract 46330 dated 3 February 1936), finally 15 from June to November 1939 (contract 62278 dated 16 August 1938), still using the P&W R-1830-64.
Northrop produced the BT-1, the USN says army designation A-17 but the Navy version had a smaller wing etc., 1 in November 1937, 52 from March to October 1938 (contract 50517 dated 16 September 1936), the company was bought by Douglas, which developed the design as the 8A, 1 to Sweden in August 1938, 10 to Peru February and June 1939, 18 for Netherlands July to November 1939, 15 for Iraq April to June 1940, 36 (USAAF A-33) for Norway October 1940 to February 1941. The USN ordered the design as the SBD, acceptances starting in June 1940.
168 SBD-3A/A-24 Navy for Army (78 June to October 1941, USAAF contract 77114 dated 27 September 1940, 90 July to October 1942)
170 SBD-4A/A-24A Navy for Army (October 1942 to March 1943, these and the second batch of SBD-3A on USAAF contract 91397 dated 16 April 1942)
60 SBD-5A Navy (April to July 1943, BuNos 09693 to 09752/USAAF 42-60882 to 941) "Originally Navy for Army, retained by Navy."
(All the above had Bureau Numbers and USAAF serials)
615 SBD-5A/A-24B USAAF order (March to December 1943, contract 28716 dated 1 December 1942)
1,013 total
900 SB2C-1A/A-25A USAAF order (December 1942 to March 1944, contract 38348 dated 27 May 1943, 10 A25A-1, 40 A-5, 60 A-10, 60 A-15, 240 A-20, 160 A-25, 330 A-30)
The contact for 2 Grumman TBF was dated 8 April 1940.
From USN Record of Acceptances 1935 to 1946: Douglas Aircraft Company Inc. Incorporated in Delaware November 30, 1928 and acquired the assets and business of The Douglas Co. which had been incorporated in California in July 1921, to acquire Davis-Douglas Co., formed as a partnership in 1920. In 1932 organised the Northrop Corp. and as of August 31, 1937 merged this company with the Douglas Aircraft Co. Inc. In 1940 organised Western Land Improvement Co. In 1941 Palisades Realty Co. was liquidated.
RAAF Chiefs of Staff reports, first mention of 150 A-25 Shrike order is week ending 30 July 1943, shipments starting in August, as of week ending 3 September order expected to be completed by December, week ending 17 September "Due to temporary restrictions on West Coast shipping the aircraft are moving to the East Coast for shipment." 10 reported on way week ending 22 October 1943 with order to be completed by January 1944, as of week ending 1 November shipments are expected to be effected as follows, 12 in November, 120 in December and balance in January.
The 10 arrived week ending 26 November, A25-A-15-CS models, as uncrated deck cargo on the Port Caroline, adhesive plaster used to protect flaps, joints etc. Week ending 10 December "Shipments being held until clarification of radio equipment." Week ending 24 December first Shrike under test, week ending 31 December testing completed.
Week ending 14 January 1944, Action taken to cancel 142 dive bombers from RAAF allocations, it is understood most will be Shrikes
Week ending 21 January 1944, Remainder of Shrike order cancelled.
Week ending 11 February 1944, Possibility of returning the Shrikes to US authorities being investigated.
Week ending 25 February 1944, "9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 10 December 1944, "4 issued to USAAF. 9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 17 December 1944, "5 issued to USAAF. 9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 26 January 1945, "10 issued to USAAF"
RAAF Vengeance, initially replaced early/mid 1941 Brewster Bermuda order, 5 reported shipped week ending 22 May 1942, arrived week ending 4 June, another 10 reported shipped week ending 10 July, week ending 24 July "Ship carrying Vengeances ran aground on reef off Queensland coast, to date 10 Vengeance salvaged and at 3 Aircraft Depot." Next shipment reported week ending 29 January 1943. After Japan attacked the RAAF asked for 370, that was cut to 197, later to 366 and finally 400.
Week ending 10 December 1943, "Of 76 vengeance assembled by 1 AD, all are second hand, having 5 to 487 hours on them, some required an additional 662 man hours."
Week ending 31 March 1944 "Instructions have been forwarded to cancel all aircraft not yet shipped."
Week ending 5 May 1944, last of 342 arrivals, 76 of which are still in crates, ultimately 288 erected, the last week ending 27 July 1945.
Northrop A-17, 110 from November 1935 to January 1937 plus 2 A-17AS in August 1936 (Contract 7326 dated 1 March 1935), 100 A-17A from February to December 1937 (contract 8323 dated 29 January 1936), then 29 A-17A June to August 1938 (contract 8323 SA 8 dated 8 November 1937), the A-17 and A-17AS from Northrop, the A-17A from Douglas
Douglas TBD Devastator, 1 in June 1937, 113 from September 1937 to June 1938 (contract 46330 dated 3 February 1936), finally 15 from June to November 1939 (contract 62278 dated 16 August 1938), still using the P&W R-1830-64.
Northrop produced the BT-1, the USN says army designation A-17 but the Navy version had a smaller wing etc., 1 in November 1937, 52 from March to October 1938 (contract 50517 dated 16 September 1936), the company was bought by Douglas, which developed the design as the 8A, 1 to Sweden in August 1938, 10 to Peru February and June 1939, 18 for Netherlands July to November 1939, 15 for Iraq April to June 1940, 36 (USAAF A-33) for Norway October 1940 to February 1941. The USN ordered the design as the SBD, acceptances starting in June 1940.
168 SBD-3A/A-24 Navy for Army (78 June to October 1941, USAAF contract 77114 dated 27 September 1940, 90 July to October 1942)
170 SBD-4A/A-24A Navy for Army (October 1942 to March 1943, these and the second batch of SBD-3A on USAAF contract 91397 dated 16 April 1942)
60 SBD-5A Navy (April to July 1943, BuNos 09693 to 09752/USAAF 42-60882 to 941) "Originally Navy for Army, retained by Navy."
(All the above had Bureau Numbers and USAAF serials)
615 SBD-5A/A-24B USAAF order (March to December 1943, contract 28716 dated 1 December 1942)
1,013 total
900 SB2C-1A/A-25A USAAF order (December 1942 to March 1944, contract 38348 dated 27 May 1943, 10 A25A-1, 40 A-5, 60 A-10, 60 A-15, 240 A-20, 160 A-25, 330 A-30)
The contact for 2 Grumman TBF was dated 8 April 1940.
From USN Record of Acceptances 1935 to 1946: Douglas Aircraft Company Inc. Incorporated in Delaware November 30, 1928 and acquired the assets and business of The Douglas Co. which had been incorporated in California in July 1921, to acquire Davis-Douglas Co., formed as a partnership in 1920. In 1932 organised the Northrop Corp. and as of August 31, 1937 merged this company with the Douglas Aircraft Co. Inc. In 1940 organised Western Land Improvement Co. In 1941 Palisades Realty Co. was liquidated.
RAAF Chiefs of Staff reports, first mention of 150 A-25 Shrike order is week ending 30 July 1943, shipments starting in August, as of week ending 3 September order expected to be completed by December, week ending 17 September "Due to temporary restrictions on West Coast shipping the aircraft are moving to the East Coast for shipment." 10 reported on way week ending 22 October 1943 with order to be completed by January 1944, as of week ending 1 November shipments are expected to be effected as follows, 12 in November, 120 in December and balance in January.
The 10 arrived week ending 26 November, A25-A-15-CS models, as uncrated deck cargo on the Port Caroline, adhesive plaster used to protect flaps, joints etc. Week ending 10 December "Shipments being held until clarification of radio equipment." Week ending 24 December first Shrike under test, week ending 31 December testing completed.
Week ending 14 January 1944, Action taken to cancel 142 dive bombers from RAAF allocations, it is understood most will be Shrikes
Week ending 21 January 1944, Remainder of Shrike order cancelled.
Week ending 11 February 1944, Possibility of returning the Shrikes to US authorities being investigated.
Week ending 25 February 1944, "9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 10 December 1944, "4 issued to USAAF. 9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 17 December 1944, "5 issued to USAAF. 9 aircraft not erected to stay that way, will be returned to USA"
Week ending 26 January 1945, "10 issued to USAAF"
RAAF Vengeance, initially replaced early/mid 1941 Brewster Bermuda order, 5 reported shipped week ending 22 May 1942, arrived week ending 4 June, another 10 reported shipped week ending 10 July, week ending 24 July "Ship carrying Vengeances ran aground on reef off Queensland coast, to date 10 Vengeance salvaged and at 3 Aircraft Depot." Next shipment reported week ending 29 January 1943. After Japan attacked the RAAF asked for 370, that was cut to 197, later to 366 and finally 400.
Week ending 10 December 1943, "Of 76 vengeance assembled by 1 AD, all are second hand, having 5 to 487 hours on them, some required an additional 662 man hours."
Week ending 31 March 1944 "Instructions have been forwarded to cancel all aircraft not yet shipped."
Week ending 5 May 1944, last of 342 arrivals, 76 of which are still in crates, ultimately 288 erected, the last week ending 27 July 1945.
