1939 - May/June 1940:
-RAF: what do you mean 'fighter escort'??
-French AF: there is no such thing as 'fighter escort'.
-USAAC: fighter what?
-Soviet AF: fighter escort? Do you want to spend some time in Siberia?
Fairey Battle: Performance and Tactics
- Thread starter Zipper730
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
1939 - May/June 1940:
-RAF: what do you mean 'fighter escort'??
-French AF: there is no such thing as 'fighter escort'.
-USAAC: fighter what?
-Soviet AF: fighter escort? Do you want to spend some time in Siberia?
It isn't easy in contested air space, after the Battle of France Goering asked where his Luftwaffe had gone.
Battle was approx the size of Il-2, wing area was just 2% greater. What was not similar was protection (Il-2 is undisputed champion) and engine power. One will need a lot more power to afford protection, here the Hercules can come in handy. Hercules XI (early 1941?) was good for 1575 HP at low altitudes, while the Mk.VI (late 1941) added another 50-100 HP. Even when accounted for extra engine-related drag this is a big power surplus.
- Thread starter
- #44
I thought the problem with fighter escort had to do with coordinating the escorts so they would be in the same part of sky (well, maybe not the *exact* same spot, but...), you're saying they didn't even *contemplate* using fighters to escort the planes along?
So the problem was that they were too busy defending waves of Bf.109's to be able to escort Battles?
Books are written on such things, how do you escort a squadron of Battles?
Kevin J
Banned
1 Squadron of fighters for each Battle, that's how it was done in 1941 with Blenheims.
Well the Battle is slower and there are more enemy A/C around so lets double that eh?
- Thread starter
- #48
Yeah, but I don't have such books. A title would be nice.
You have already been given one by Fubar, just consider how you would escort a squadron of Battles on a low level attack on a bridge?
Kevin J
Banned
First you destroy all the enemy fighters. That's what happened in the Pacific. First the Hellcats went in to clear the skies of fighters. Then the Avengers were sent in.
Well yes, but not 20 miles from Japan the day after Pearl Habor.
buffnut453
Captain
I'd also recommend "Twelve Days in May" by Brian Cull.
buffnut453
Captain
Yes, but much of the discussion relatesmto the challenges of synching up bombers with fighter escorts. To do that, a thorough understanding is needed of what.the fighters we're doing at the time.
Shortround6
Major General
Fairey Battles of No. 88 Squadron RAF based at Mourmelon-le-Grand, fly in formation with Curtiss Hawk 75s of 1e escadrille GC 1/2 of the French Air Force.
It is a lot easier to arrange a propaganda photo than an actual escort mission. In many cases the bombers were not at the same bases as the fighters so some sort of rendezvous was needed. The communications network was a bit lacking (massive understatement) If the fighters weren't there (at the rendezvous) the bombers often pressed on to the attack anyway.
calling off the attack and trying again the next day on the Bridge targets just ment another days worth of German troops and supplies across the river.
That looks like the perfect formation for a bounce. I read about such formations that lost two or three of their members without anyone being aware of what happened.
Shortround6
Major General
The Battle had no dive bombing sight. While the plane could dive aiming would be by a piece of chewing gum stuck on the windscreen (or a few dabs of paint).
The Battle also had no dive brakes and it's max allowable speed was higher than some dive bombers with dive brakes operated at, meaning a higher. less accurate drop point for the needed pull out.
for attacking road convoys a low altitude attack is preferred as the idea is to space out the bombs along the line of march, wagons, trucks or whatever. Dropping 4 bombs in a cluster in a diving attack is overkill on one part of the column and under kill on the rest. Dropping only one or two bombs in a diving attack an climbing back up to r-attack in a plane that climbs as poorly as the Battle is hardly a good idea.
- Thread starter
- #59
While I knew the bombers and fighters weren't at the same base. I'm just surprised they couldn't arrange the rendezvous. As for the communications network, why was it lacking? Was it due to poor planning, or due to the war itself?
That's a strange feature to omit from a plane that could do dive-bombing, wouldn't you say?
Look at the pic posted by Shortround. The enemy can dive out of the sun, they can dive from behind or just climb up from behind and below. It looks like the Battles are being escorted, in fact it is just presenting a bigger, equally slow target with all eyes and guns in the same formation.
