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The P-40D had four .50 cal guns and RAF Ace Caldwell, I believe it was, preferred it that way. There was a case where he was covering a convoy and two 109's came down out of the Sun and hit him good. He turned around, shot down one of the 109's and sent the other one packing.
Strafing ground troops was about all the .30cal MG was good for, it certainly wasn't effective against other planes. It wasn't good enough for any other contemporary US fighter.The P-40D had four .50 cal guns and RAF Ace Caldwell, I believe it was, preferred it that way. There was a case where he was covering a convoy and two 109's came down out of the Sun and hit him good. He turned around, shot down one of the 109's and sent the other one packing.
Deleting the four .30 cal would have decreased the value of the P-39 for strafing, and on the 'Canal it w as sorely needed for that. The Marines credited the P-400's of the 67th with saving Henderson Field with their close support. And I think deleting the 37MM and putting in a third .50 cal would have been a good idea for optimized air to air P-39's. With the "roman candle" firing rate of the cannon, the chance of hitting anything with the 37MM other than a bomber going straight and level was pretty slim and its trajectory was so different from that of the .50 cal and .30 cal that hitting something other than the ground with all three was unlikely.
I enjoy the debate. .30s were worthless against armored German planes. May have been of limited use against unarmored Japanese planes. If four .50s was adequate, then a 37mm and twin .50s were certainly adequate. Lose the .30s and outclimb the contemporary Zero. Big advantage.Sorry to disagree, but a .30 (or .303) will easily pass through aluminum, penetrate fuel tanks, sever flight controls and so on.
Saburo Sakai was nearly killed by a .30 caliber bullet from an SBD that penetrated his cockpit, so be careful about discounting it.
British kept four .303 guns in the Spitfire until 1944?in part because the 20mm ran out of ammo before the .303s.
37mm jamming was fixed in early/mid '42 with the K model (Bell model 26) which provided the small exit vents in the nose to exhaust heated cockpit air ducted into the gun bay. This prevented the gun from freezing at altitude. Soviets considered the 37mm very reliable and more reliable than the 20mm.Hmmmm, American .30 cal was worthless.
Japanese 7.7mm in Ki 27s, Ki 43s and cowl guns in A6M shot down how many american planes?
British ,303s (actually same round as the Japanese 7.7) shot down how many German aircraft in 1939-41?
American .30 cal has 13% more kinetic energy than Japanese 7.7mm.
British kept four .303 guns in the Spitfire until 1944?in part because the 20mm ran out of ammo before the .303s.
The 37mm was notorious for jamming in the early versions. with a 30 round ammo supply it was good for about 12 seconds of firing time.
if the 37 jams or is out of ammo the P-39 had the fire power of a P-40C if it kept the .30 cal guns. Without them?????
But the Germans used a fixed 7.92mm MG (MG17) for their aircraft's armament during the early part of the war: Bf109, Fw190, He112, Bf110, Ju87, etc.30s were worthless against armored German planes.
Just a couple of errors in this article, all in the last paragraph. No -35 engines in any Q models. All N/Q models had the -85 engine with 1200hp for takeoff and 1125hp at 15500'.An article I found said that the underwing .50 cal guns on the later P-39's really screwed up the handling and caused it to be actually slower than the earlier models. We have some evidence that some Soviet P-39's had the underwing .50 cal guns removed.
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The Germans replaced the .30cal MGs with the 13mm (.50 caliber) MG for their 109G-6 and 190A-6. They apparently thought the .30s were not powerful enough.But the Germans used a fixed 7.92mm MG (MG17) for their aircraft's armament during the early part of the war: Bf109, Fw190, He112, Bf110, Ju87, etc.
The MG17 was literally a .31 caliber MG, so how were the Germans able to overcome the British armor, then?
By the way, I would assume the price for a P-39Q did not include the V-1710 engine, radios and guns, all of which would have been GFP.
Several years ago, my friends and I were at the range and they were plinking at a 5/16" thick steel target with their .223s set up aboit 35 yards out.I also read where during the BoB they took a section of Spitfire armor plate and fired a .303 round into it to demonstrate to the pilots that they had some protection. . The round went through the armor like it was balsa wood.
And there are accounts from British pilots in the BoB of emptying their entire magazines of eight .30cal guns into a single He111 and watching it fly on to the target. Now I much prefer actual documented tests to anecdotal stories but if the .30cal gun was sufficient then the .50cal, 20mm, 30mm, 37mm guns would not have been developed. And the .30cal MG would have been used on AAf fighters, which it was not, except for the P-39.Several years ago, my friends and I were at the range and they were plinking at a 5/16" thick steel target with their .223s set up aboit 35 yards out.
It would ring like a bell with their hits. Being a smartass, I got out my 7x57 Mauser and took a shot. The target didn't move - ok, so I missed, no problem, took more careful aim and let fly. Again, nothing - I missed again??
Baffled, I went out and looked at the target. Scores of divots from the .223 impacts and lo and behold: two large holes near the center. The 7x57 passed through it like it was cardboard...
.30 caliber rounds can and will do damage.
Careful! I am an amateur, but I am stumbling over the 35 yards (32 meters). From the stories about the RAF gun convergence debate, typical engagement ranges seemed to be around 750 feet (~225 meters). Doesn't that make a considerable difference in how much energy the bullet will retain?Several years ago, my friends and I were at the range and they were plinking at a 5/16" thick steel target with their .223s set up aboit 35 yards out.
It would ring like a bell with their hits. Being a smartass, I got out my 7x57 Mauser and took a shot. The target didn't move - ok, so I missed, no problem, took more careful aim and let fly. Again, nothing - I missed again??
Baffled, I went out and looked at the target. Scores of divots from the .223 impacts and lo and behold: two large holes near the center. The 7x57 passed through it like it was cardboard...
.30 caliber rounds can and will do damage.