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Was this magical levitation device located at Muroc Airfield?
Please note that a Spitfire V, if measured the same way as some of these aircraft (magicly levitated to cruising altitude with a warm engine) was good for about 650 miles so obviously large adjustments have to be made to get to operational ranges/radius.
I see that 'tactical-only' Luftwaffe myth is alive and well, despite 1000 mile capable Bf 110s, He 111s, Do 17s and Ju 88s.
Nobody is asking that a fighter floats over enemy airspace at 200 mph.
You seem to be implying that most of the aircraft we discussed have an unrealistic range estimate, but you haven't actually shown that. I say again - neither the A6M nor the Beaufighter needed to be levitated anywhere to fly 1,000 miles.
As far the range actually goes, all we have to do is compare like with like. It doesn't matter much they are all based on being magically at 15,000 feet first or all from takeoff plus time for warmup, they just all need to be roughly the same criteria. We know that the Bf 109 did not have enough range or endurance for escort missions in the BoB, and for example often had to turn back for home after only a few minutes of combat. So a fighter with similar combat capability and say, twice or three times the range (for whatever specific design reason) would have helped their cause. Objectively.
It is 636 miles from Duxford to Prague, 449 miles from Lille France to Edinburgh. Why on earth do you need a 1000 mile range? How far did the tip and run Jabo raids penetrate into UK airspace 1942/43? I no longer know what the discussion is, do you think Fairey Battles would have helped the LW just because they can cover a long distance?
True but the Beaufighter had no business trying to fight single engine fighters. Not saying it didn't on occasion.
The Zero was a great piece of engineering and a great airplane. But part of it's range seems to have been an element of luck. The Sakae engine being able to run at a cruise setting at lower than normal lean mixture without overheating or causing problems. Since this engine was actually the 2nd choice we wonder what the performance might have been otherwise.
One source claims the early Zero could cruise at 180 kts (altitude not given) at 16.4 US gallons and hour but increasing to 190kts meant 24.04 US gallons an hour and 200kts meant 26.15 gallons an hour. At max rated power it used 91.14 gallons an hour.
Spitfire V could cruise at 225mph using 29 imp gallons an hour, but at full boost (16lbs) it burned 150 imp gal an hour (180 US gal)
The early Zero held about 141 US gallons inside the plane according to one source.
The Spitfire held about 101 US gallons.
The P-40B held 160 gallons.
The Zero had 84-87.2 gallons underneath.
There's more to strategic capability than just reach. You actually have to deliver effects once you get there. What bomb load could any of the bombers carry out to 1,000 miles? According to Wikipedia (yes, I know, but it's all I have to hand at the moment), the Do17 had a combat radius of 628 miles with 1,100 lb bomb load. Extending that range would require a reduction in bomb load...and 1,100 lbs is a very long way from being a strategic load. It certainly isn't going to deliver a strategic effect.
Can you please cite your sources.
Milos Vestsik's books on La-5 and La-7 cites the ammo count as Shortround6 said.
(Gordon/Khazanov - books unfortunately are not as bolt and nuts thing)
Mosquitoes could carry a fairly heavy bomb load out to a good range with an internal bomb load, up to 4,000 lbs 3,000 miles
Wellingtons could carry 2,000-4,500 lbs internally up to 2,000 miles or more
G3M could carry a 1000+ lb bomb load over 2,500 miles
G4M could carry a 2000+ lb bomb load over 1,500 miles
Ju 88 could carry a 2000 lb bomb load internally roughly 1,000 miles, external stores limited the range more
He 111 could carry a 1000 lb bomb load internally about 1,400 miles
The CANT 1007 could carry a 2000 lb bomb load internally about 1,000 miles
The DB-7 / A-20 could carry a 1000 lb load internally about 900 miles
Ok so it looks like we are starting to delve into the elements that contribute to range. You are mentioning here fuel capacity and the ability for the engine to fly at low RPM. I would also add to that altitude capability (higher altitude cruising generally uses up less fuel and allows faster flight at lower power), overall drag (draggier airframes require more power to keep the speed up, so things like tail wheels, various protrusions for guns or engine fittings, even rear view mirrors and radio masts can all make a diffeence) and wing efficiency (a balance between drag and lift of the wing).
And then of course, weight. The tradeoff between carrying more fuel and having less weight to carry. This is the basic difference between the light and heavy fighter.
I can't understand the point you're making. Tomo Pauk made a statement indicating that the long-held view of the Luftwaffe was a tactical rather than strategic air arm was a myth. For evidence, he provided quote of 1,000 mile range for a number of German aircraft.
My point is that long range does not necessarily equate with a strategic capability. In order to have strategic capability, you also have to deliver a strategic punch once you arrive over the target, and 1,100 lbs is not a strategic punch.
Now you have Wellingtons flying 2,000 miles It is 2,100 miles from London to Cairo. Why was the Wellington replaced?
The He 111 was good for around 400 miles radius with about 4400lbs of bombs, that is a realistic radius.
It was also about as good as an early Wellington. correction welcome.
The 110 had more range than the 109 but it couldn't be used quite like a 109. The two planes were not interchangeable.
All true, so let's look at a few of these "details" like the Zero's supercharger having a critical altitude several thousand feet lower than the Merlin, (Model 21 Zero vs MK I Spit, later Spits get better, so does the Zero when it gets the two speed supercharger but that isn't till when?) ), many of these long ranges are actually done at a relatively low altitude. Less fuel burned in the climb, IF the supercharge has two gears the lower gear will use less power. At low rpm the supercharger uses less power/heats the intake charge less. But is all a juggling act. airflow through the supercharger is proportional to the square of the speed of the impeller.
but not the only difference. A MK I Spit went 5875lbs with a wooden prop. useful load is given as 1585lbs.
200lbs for the pilot & chute
646lbs for fuel
54lbs for oil
685 lbs for Military load. Guns, ammo, gun sight, even the radio or large part of the radio installation.
The structure was 1890lbs and the powerplant was 2035 of which the engine was only 1412lbs.
this plane had no armor, no self sealing, no IFF. A Spitfire II went 6172lbs with the bells and whistles of the summer of 1940.
You can swap some military equipment (guns/ammo) for more fuel for the same weight but there are some other things that need to stay.
as far as light fighters go, you can't pick lighter pilots, or use smaller parachutes, the radios are the same. There is only so much you can take-out.
there are a lot of fixed weights in a fighter unless you change the engine. Look at the Spitfire again, ANY plane using the Merlin III engine is going to have just about the same powerplant weight if not heavier (due to using a real propeller and not a hunk of tree). The light fighter cannot use a smaller radiator or use less cooling fluid. (296lbs for the cooling system).
Not as bombers, you are taking maximum range and maximum bomb load and inferring that something useful could be done at extreme range. 1000lb is not sufficient to be anything other than a nuisance.Easy! Because WW2 ended! Wellingtons were produced and still used through 1945.
Not as bombers, you are taking maximum range and maximum bomb load and inferring that something useful could be done at extreme range. 1000lb is not sufficient to be anything other than a nuisance.
Also worth pointing out, despite that lower critical altitude A6M2's didn't have a tough time against Spit V's over Darwin. We know there were many extenuating circumstances, but I think it's a safe bet that an A6M2 was competitive with a Spit I.
That sounds like a good starting point for performance comparisons. Perhaps too optimistic for real use. Thanks!A number of american aircraft ( I don't know about others) were rated with "yardstick" ranges for comparison purposes. They simply figured out what the fuel burn was for a given speed/altitude and then divided that into the total fuel capacity for the length of flight and then multiplied the cruise speed by the hours of endurance to get this range.
no allowance made for warm up, take-off, climb to altitude or even powered decent at the end of the "flight". Basically it tells you that fighter A might have a range 20% longer than fighter B but in neither case do you know what distance they can actually travel. Unfortunately AHT uses these theoretical ranges quite a bit.